There have been a number of discussions on this issue but I am starting a new thread as I want to try and make some sense of the situation
There are a number of audits in the standard:
*-Audit of the QMS to ensure conformity and effectiveness
*-Audit of the manufacturing process to determine effectiveness
*-Audit of the product to verify conformity
Added to this there are requirements by certain customers such as GM and DCX to perform "Layered Process Control Audits" (DCX description),
In the CSR of the big 3 there is added in the Ford spec the following:
"4.39.4
Process and Product audits may be conducted by appropriate process specialists from the affected areas without full quality management auditor training."
As this does not appear in the GM or DCX requirements or in the IATF guidelines then it would appear that the default is that those performing process and product audits MUST be qualified as auditors. If you have Ford and GM as customers will one "auditor" be accepted by Ford but rejected by GM or by the CB?
As we know the QMS is composed of process then in fact according to Ford then all audits can be performed by "appropriate process specialists from the affected areas without full quality management auditor training."
How does this meet with the requirements that auditors shall not audit their own work.
In other words when is an audit an audit and when is it an inspection?

ISO/TS 16949 calls out in 8.2.2 ISO 10011-1 a standard that has been withdrawn am I expected to use these guidelines
There are a number of audits in the standard:
*-Audit of the QMS to ensure conformity and effectiveness
*-Audit of the manufacturing process to determine effectiveness
*-Audit of the product to verify conformity
Added to this there are requirements by certain customers such as GM and DCX to perform "Layered Process Control Audits" (DCX description),
In the CSR of the big 3 there is added in the Ford spec the following:
"4.39.4
Process and Product audits may be conducted by appropriate process specialists from the affected areas without full quality management auditor training."
As this does not appear in the GM or DCX requirements or in the IATF guidelines then it would appear that the default is that those performing process and product audits MUST be qualified as auditors. If you have Ford and GM as customers will one "auditor" be accepted by Ford but rejected by GM or by the CB?
As we know the QMS is composed of process then in fact according to Ford then all audits can be performed by "appropriate process specialists from the affected areas without full quality management auditor training."
How does this meet with the requirements that auditors shall not audit their own work.
In other words when is an audit an audit and when is it an inspection?

ISO/TS 16949 calls out in 8.2.2 ISO 10011-1 a standard that has been withdrawn am I expected to use these guidelines
