Business Plan Requirements - 4.1.1.2 Scope of quality objectives in the business plan

D
#1
Business Plan

I have the standrd in my hand Marc - are you ready?
4.1.1.2 Scope of quality objectives in the business plan. I think we are missing the boat here. Can anyone define?
 
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Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration
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#2
I have to order a copy of 'the latest' to address these. I'm still with my old copy. Will order tomorrow and address these next week..
 
F
#3
Business Plan required?

I think that having a Business Plan is not expressly requested in the new ISO/TS 16949:2002. Do you think that it could be anyway an indirect requirement derived from the requirement of planning quality?
 

Howard Atkins

Forum Administrator
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#4
I am afraid that it is a demand

5.4.1.1 Quality objectives — Supplemental
Top management shall define quality objectives and measurements that shall be included in the business plan and
used to deploy the quality policy.
NOTE Quality objectives should address customer expectations and be achievable within a defined time period.
5.6.1.1 Quality management system performance
These results shall be recorded to provide, as a minimum, evidence of the achievement of
- the quality objectives specified in the business plan, and
 
#5
Business plan required?

I actually had this conversation a day or so ago. Howard, you are right to an extent. 16949 does not explicitly say “the organization shall have a business plan”, but the two quotes you supplied indicate there is an expectation of a business plan. The first one: “shall be included in the business plan” is about as close as it gets. It would be impossible to meet this “shall” without a business plan. I don’t believe there is an “as applicable” attached to this. I would be interested to see how registrars are viewing this.
 
#6
The two paragraphs quoted have been revised. Refer to the latest realease 03/01/2002. The new release states that quality objectives and measurements shall appear in a business plan. However a business plan is not a document that can be audited so it becomes a non-value added request. What the auditor will be interested in is the the results of quality objectives and the measurements taken. This per "Hank Gryn" at the rollout meeting.
 

Howard Atkins

Forum Administrator
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#7
These quotes were from the standard that I bought 2 weeks ago from ISO, are you telling us that it has changed again?
The copy I quoted from says 2002-03-01
 
#8
Howard, I stand corrected. I must have went brain dead when I read your quotes.
However the remainder is excerpts from the discussion at the rollout meeting.
Sorry for the confusion.
 

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration
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#9
db said:
I actually had this conversation a day or so ago. Howard, you are right to an extent. 16949 does not explicitly say “the organization shall have a business plan”, but the two quotes you supplied indicate there is an expectation of a business plan. The first one: “shall be included in the business plan” is about as close as it gets. It would be impossible to meet this “shall” without a business plan. I don’t believe there is an “as applicable” attached to this. I would be interested to see how registrars are viewing this.
Has the status on the requirement for a business plan stabilized?
 
T

tomvehoski

#10
Marc said:
Has the status on the requirement for a business plan stabilized?
Had this pop up in a TS upgrade audit for a client a few weeks ago. The auditor asked to see the business plan. We stated there was no document called a business plan, but rather the complete system, measurables, objectives, etc. equaled the business plan. The auditor insisted it had to be a document and was threatening a major NC. I was not allowed to participate in the audit (very strict about consultants being around, so I stayed off site). I told the client to make the auditor show her where in the standard it required a document. After several hours and calls back to the registrar technical manager, the auditor backed off. He interviewed the owner about his strategy, goals, plans, etc. Since he had a good plan in his head, it was accepted as the business plan.

It still ended up being a minor NC because the quality manual wording indicated that there was a formal document. Just changed the wording to correct it.
 
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