Calibration Certificates - Does 17025 require that all 'As Found' data be recorded?

B

brettr

#1
Does 17025 require that all 'As Found' data be recorded and maintained for any calibration that results in a certificate being issued?

Also, when 5.10.4.2 states 'When a statement of compliance with a specification...', is 17025 refering to itself, as in 'Conformance with ISO 17025' or is it refering to any other specification?

First post. Thanks in advance.

Brett
 
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howste

Thaumaturge
Super Moderator
#2
Welcome to the Cove!

Here are a couple of the most relevant clauses to your first question:
5.10.2 Test reports and calibration certificates
Each test report or calibration certificate shall include at least the following information, unless the laboratory has valid reasons for not doing so:
f) a description of, the condition of, and unambiguous identification of the item(s) tested or calibrated;
See also:
5.10.4.3 When an instrument for calibration has been adjusted or repaired, the calibration results before and after adjustment or repair, if available, shall be reported.
It looks like there's a little wiggle room, but not much. Unless there's a really good reason for not reporting the as-received condition, it should be included.

As for the second question, when an ISO standard refers to itself, it uses the term "this International Standard." 5.10.4.2 is talking about other standards.
 
B

brettr

#3
Thanks for the welocome and the quick reply.

As a commercial calibration house we do indicate the As Found condition as In Tolerance or Out of Tolerance, and we do provide As Found data when an instrument id found to be OOT.

However, we just had an 17025 audit and the auditor insisted that if the Calibration Certificate stated that the calibration performed was in compliance to 17025 then initial data had to be recorded and maintained on EVERY calibration performed, whether the customer requested it or not. This is the issue that I'm trying to get clarification on.

Brett
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#4
Precisely....

Brettr,

I am NOT an expert in metrology, calibration, ISO 17025.... but I know how to read Standards. I read my copy of the ISO/IEC 17025 , First Edition. I agree with you. I don't see a requirement in that Standard that forces you to record the "as-received" data, IF the device was found to be IN TOLERANCE.

We have a Cover that is very knowledgeable about these issues: Hershal. Hopefully he can add his 23 cents.
 
G

Graeme

#5
brettr said:
Does 17025 require that all 'As Found' data be recorded and maintained for any calibration that results in a certificate being issued?
Welcome, Brett!

To add to the earlier comments --
  • If the test item is not adjustable and the expected result is a report of value (the value of a standard resistor, for example) then only one value is reported, along with its uncertainty.
  • If the test item performance is within specification and no adjustments are made, then the "As Found" data is equal to the "As Left" condition. Some labs just state that, others copy the data into the other column.
  • If the results of the first calibration run indicate that repair or adjustment is required, then the results of that run are the As Found data. After the repair or adjustment is successfully completed, the results of a final calibration run are the As Left data.
brettr said:
Also, when 5.10.4.2 states 'When a statement of compliance with a specification...', is 17025 refering to itself, as in 'Conformance with ISO 17025' or is it refering to any other specification?
This statement refers to some other specification - almost always the performance specification of the item being calibrated, or the customer's requirements if different. When you calibrate an item you can do one of two things with the data:
  • You can report the data and your measurement uncertainty without any evaluation, and let the customer decide what to do. (Most customers don't like this!) Or,
  • You can report the data and state the compliance status of the data with respect to the performance specifications. For instance, "the test item performance was determined to be outside of specification limits at points x, y and z. After adjustment, the test item performance was determined to be within specification limits at all points". (This is what most customers want.)
In the latter case, you must consider the uncertainties of your measurement system and the test item when determining if the measured value is outside the specification limits. That is why guardbands are often used to create narrower test limits - to reduce the chance of a borderline "within specification" value possibly being actually out of specification when the uncertainty is added.

Note: remember that all of this only STRICTLY applies when you are doing an accredited calibration or a proficiency test. It is still a "best practice", though, and could be applied to all of your calibrations when it is economical to do so.
 

Hershal

Metrologist-Auditor
Staff member
Super Moderator
#6
Brettr,

ISO/IEC 17025 does not specifically require the recording of "as found - as left" data provided the instrument or item is within the applicable specs, as others have already pointed out. However, the Standard does require recording sufficient information to enable an adequate evaluation or repeat of the measurement, according to 4.12.2.1 which may or may not require specific readings, depending on the measurement and instrument. Also, any readings taken must be kept.

As for the 5.10.4.2 question, Graeme is right on target. It does mean some other applicable specification. This specific reference to another specification is different than 5.10.4.1.b however, in that 5.10.4.1.b specifically refers to "an accepted metrological specification" and 5.10.4.2 is primarily addressing such specifications as the manufacturer's specs.

Hope this helps.

Hershal
 
#7
I just want to add to the conversation that one of my approved vendors for calibration typically does not report as found data, but does state if the instrument was found within mfg's tolerances. They do report as found data only when the instrument was found out of tolerance.

They do this to save money for the customer. Most places where you request as found data, they charge you extra for the information. If the information is not critical where you need to know approximate values, then a simple certification telling me that the instrument was found within tolerance is fine.
 
W

wilsonmm

#8
In our system, a government calibration lab calibrates test equipment in accordance with a schedule that's set for each item by model number. Items that pass are given a new white cal label showing the date cal'ed and the next due date.

Any porition found to be out of tolerance is adjusted back in and a fact sheet is sent back with the item so we can determine if that out of tolerance condition caused any problems in work done prior to its calibration.

Any item out of tolerance that can not be adjusted back into tolerance is reported back to the owning facility. It is then determined if that function that failed is critical or not. If it's a feature that isn't used by the owning facility and the rest of the item is okay, the rest of the test equipment item is cal'ed and it's given a yellow cal label (limited cal) and the problem is stated on the label.

Items failing cal in a used function are disposed of and replaced.

No spec sheet is provided for items passing cal.
 
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