Calibration Outsourcing vs. In House Calibration - Outrageous Costs of Calibration

S

skappesser

#11
NIST in Gaithersburg, Maryland may still offer courses in dimensional metrology. I took courses there and they are the best.
Also, do you do any business with the government? If so you can join GIDEP. That's "Government and Industry Data Exchange Program". Their Metrology section offers thousands of detailed and downloadable calibration procedures used by the Military and other agencies. Click on www.GIDEP.org
 
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Elsmar Forum Sponsor

apestate

Quite Involved in Discussions
#12
How much of this equipment is used to qualify product as acceptable?

What are the tolerances of the product features to be checked? i.e. what are you making...

These questions come up as a logical next step in assessing internal calibration opportunities.

If you are supplying product to the state government, federal government, or military, you might be eligible to participate in the GIDEP program. GIDEP acts as a clearinghouse for all sorts of information for products and services translated between private industry and government activities. Their database of calibration procedures for all measurement tools is well known.

Participation is simple, you must account for the time and money saved through use of the program and share with them anything you might be able to, such as an operating manual for a broken oscilloscope you may have thrown out.

www.gidep.org

If you are not eligible for GIDEP participation, there are "calibration procedures" available for purchase by many vendors and names. I do not recommend them. I have developed procedures for calipers, micrometers, drop indicators and test indicators. When you really know your tools, it's not too difficult.

That's the information I can give you. You don't need my opinion on deficiencies in calibration systems.
 
G

Gert Sorensen

#13
1. While I agree at this point, that in the past the company did little to work with the Calibration houses locally to reduce costs, realistically there are so few of them here, the options are limited with reducing costs.
For 90% of the calibration that is done on over 350 pieces of measurement equipment, I already have just two sources.
Same thing could be said here in Denmark, but I actually cut costs at my previous company by more than 30% by using just one company. I simply got a new quote based on them doing all of our calibration.

2. My question was really based on the fact that out of the 350 pcs. of equipment, at least 250 pcs. are the handheld calipers, micrometers, drop indicators, etc. that I felt the cost savings could be made by performing the calibration internally.
It is easy enough to perform calibration on verniers, micrometers and such. Take a course, and your all set. Been there, done that, and I knew nothing about it when I got the job :)

3. For vision systems, optical comparators, surface plates, temperature and vacuum gages to mention a few, my intent was to continue using an outside source.
Smart thinking.

4. Having master gage blocks traceable to NIST that would not be used for any other purpose except for performing calibrations should cover the traceable to an approved national standard.
Firstly, remember to take a good look at those blocks. Usually you only use about 25% of the set, but you get the entire set calibrated. Secondly, check your certificates for the set and evaluate of the interval is proper. No need to get it calibrated every year or so, if you handle it with proper care.

5. I think the part I am lacking would be the actual how-to, at what frequency, to what increment I believe would be the last part. I previously worked at a facility where 98% of their calibration was done in house and I was instrumental to getting them ISO certified so I know it must be acceptable.
How to? Take a two day course :) Frequency? Look at your calibration results and the use of the item. If calibration results are fine (no deviation over time) and the operators of the instruments are trained and treat it properly you can usually increase intervals. Depending on the use and the operator a micrometer, for instance, can have intervals up to 3 years IMO.

6. Where does one go for the how - to's ??? I think having a competent employee here capable to perform this as part of their job function is in place, I just need to be able to furnish them with workable procedures.
Why do you need to furnish WP's?? If you have a competent employee let him/her make their own procedures. Then you are sure that they fit the task.
 
C

ChuckHughes

#14
I am with Cathy and the others that indicate you pay too much for calibration.

As a consultant I will offer my services for only half of what you are currently paying.:notme:

Seriously any organization that is making linear measurements frequently and has self calibrating equipment should pay only for a linkage to NIST in procuring calibration services.

Pay for your blocks and pins to be "calibrated" (actually certified as within standards for precision) and set up a "check before use" program that requires mikes, calipers, drop gages, etc to be compared to the "calibrated" blocks/pins on some frequency. Who does the check is your call. The frequency of checks is your call.

YOU set the frequency of calibration.... NOT the calibration service... That is like asking your life insurance salesman if you need more life insurance:agree1:

I hope that helps.
 
A

andygr

#15
As covered by Chuck the interval is set by the user based on the actual equipment usage. It is a risk based system. Use something a lot the risk goes up and so to mitigate the risk the interval is shortened.
Most manafactures of equipment have recomended calibration intervals so I would start there. Tak a look at how you use the equipment to see if you might need to shorten the interval to reflect your needs. Use the history you have on file to see what changes are seen for the "as found" values to set your interval.
For procedures logic and commen sense go a long way. Remember that you want to check a min of 3 points cover values at the min mid and max ranges of use.
Here is a link to general starting info for creating a procedure
http://longislandindicator.com/calibration.html
There are plenty of procedures that can be purchased and consultants that can be used to suport procedure creation. Just search on the net.
If you have been relying on your calibration source to cover recall and review of equipment for calibration then you need to make sure you get a good calibration tracking and recall system in place. If you are not familiare with this then this is where a consultant would be of some real help to head off problems and keep you from serious mistakes.
 
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C

crendfrey

#17
Cathy,
First, I must state I work for a calibration lab. We focus mainly on scales and are accredited with a scope of up to 200,000Lbs. We are not “cheap”, however we are not “outrageous” either. That being said:
You get what you pay for.
Andygr’s last post was dead on.
You truly need to establish your own requirements regarding frequency, tolerance, user range, and the implied “risks” of those requirements.
Part of my job here is to help guide and educate our customers regarding the care and maintenance of their equipment including calibration.
We have customers who need calibration every 15 days and we always find between 3 and 4 scales broken every trip.:bonk:
We also have customers who perform internal calibration checks, we go in twice a year to issue documentation and find maybe 2 out of 75 scales out of tolerance.:agree1:
On many occasions we recommend less frequent calibrations depending on the past and present calibration reports of customer equipment, the environment they are used in, etc.
Highly sensitive equipment requires more care, not necessarily more calibration.
Any reputable calibration lab should be willing to work with you.
Fortunately or unfortunately depending on what side of the fence you are on, the trend in the industry is toward accredited calibration even if only once a year. This establishes the competency and objectivity your customers are looking for.
If you are exceedingly through and, competent technicians to maintain your own equipment and can establish the objectivity required, you should be ok however I do recommend accredited documentation at least once a year.:notme:
 
K

Ken K

#18
Mitutoyo offers gage calibration courses. Perfect for the beginner and the documentation given you is worth the price of admission. It includes many calibration procedures for calipers, micrometers, etc.

You can check their web site to see if any are offered near you.
 
#19
Cathy
One of the pressures I used to be under when I was inspector/calibration chap was from above to prioritise production work over calibration. This was resolved by a contractor taking part of the work load, keeping total control in house. If your management can see the savings, this isn't a problem. You keep all the equipment in house, no delays, and after assessing the certificates, the periods can be extended, further reducing costs. I have sent you a PM, let us know your thoughts.
Paul
 

CalRich

Involved In Discussions
#20
You are right about the cost of outsourced calibrations - many people do not know that the profit margin for most calibrations performed by a commercial calibration lab vary between 50% and 75%!
Hmm... well, many calibrations can be no profits as well. Maybe our lab is just not a savvy in business as others, but if we have an order with 1 or 2 gages on it, it's a loss considering the contract review, cleaning, and every part of the process. Or, certain types of gages/equipment that may take longer than expected. We try to be fair to ourselves, but usually favor the customer in terms of charging for the time spent.
Having worked in the calibration industry for 22 years I can also advise you to get some training, a calibration consultant, or hire an experienced calibration technician. It is not a skill set that can be self-taught and the resources needed are not going to be "cheap".
Agreed. Some companies think any dummy can do this. (sometimes our own). But it takes someone with a variety of skills: mathmatical, mechanical, analytical, problem-solving, and especially the ability to deal daily with politics and red tape.
 
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