Can I exclude Customer Property? ISO 9001 Clause 7.5.4

[Big Jim]

Re: Clause7.5.4 Can I exclude Customer Property?

I can't tell if it applies to you from the description of your company, but in many casting shops, the molds are customer property.

 

[gooofii]

Re: Clause 7.5.4 - Can I exclude Customer Property?

Gooofii,
THanak you for your kind advise. Hope I need more help and advise from you until I complete my Quality MAnual.

Can you also clarify the clause 7.6 Control of monitoring and measuring equipment ?

In our company we normally use normal vernier calipers sort of stuff and not any rocket science involves.

What sort of calibration need to done and what records need to be maintained here.

Is it possible for you to clarify?

divyavb,
I thought I would raise the conversation to the cove fellows as i am sure they can help you aswell better than me.

wel, as for the calibration, what we normally have is a Standard meter and that is we regularly check every period of time. For other electronic devices, you should also do a test reguraly to assure it is accurate and precise, but perhaps in your case you dont have electronic devises

 

[Bob Bonville]

Re: Clause 7.5.4 - Can I exclude Customer Property?

I didn't specifically see "software" mentioned in the thread, but customer property can also extend to software as well.

bob

 

[Coury Ferguson]

Re: Clause 7.5.4 - Can I exclude Customer Property?

Another consideration is product that was "shipped in place" which means the Customer's product has been paid for and we are responsible to protect and preserve until the Customer take possession of the product. I think that also falls under Customer Property.

 

[JaneB]

Re: Clause7.5.4 Can I exclude Customer Property?

Jane,

My doubt araise from your first post.

As a manufacturing/ Prop hiring company, we do get the drawings from client and input the information from the drawings and manufacture and deliver to the customer. And do not return the customer property(drawings & specifications)

That's why, I'm confused should I exclude this clause or not.

Divyavb80,

I'm sorry if I confused you - I got interested in the topic 'in general'. Also, 'do we return it?' isn't a failsafe check, as has been agreed in this thread.

First, do not exclude it from your scope.

Second: don't worry. Excluding (or not) this particular clause isn't a big thing; it shouldn't have a big impact at all even if you make the 'wrong call'.

Why? Because if you do exclude it, and later your auditor (who will have the benefit of being there and seeing your whole system, which I can't) disagreed and said this clause should be excluded, this will (I assume) be at your pre-audit (before the main audit). No drama: you would just add the exclusion into your manual before The Audit.

Exclusion/inclusion of certain clauses, such as the 7.3 clause on design, would have a huge impact on a system, if the exclusion wasn't a valid one. This one wouldn't (or shouldn't).

Because really, all you need to do is what I hope & expect that you are doing already:

• Checking whatever you receive from your customer (drawings, specs) to use, in order to make sure it/they are accurate & fit for your use; and if not (or if they are damaged - eg, deleted/lost/only some received), telling your customer & rectifying the situation.
  
• Making sure your customers' property (eg drawings) are identified - eg, by using their filenames & versions, storing them in certain locations, etc
  
• Protecting & keeping their stuff safe the whole time while it's in your hands. Your customers would (rightly) expect for example, that you don't allow people not on your staff to see their stuff, or don't just toss copies of their confidential drawings out in the paper waste bin, where they might possibly be found & seen by others, but that you dispose of them so as to keep them protected (eg, shred, delete etc)

You would/should build controls to make sure these things happen into your system procedures (you don't need a separate 'customer supplied property procedure!).

OK?

 

[cheahga]

Clause 7.5.4 - How do you define Personal Data

Recently, I was asked on this question on the definition of personal data as customer property.

If let's say a company (food processing with no physical customers property and customers IP being withheld) is looking for new business with potential customers, in order to assess the business risk of doing business with this potential customers, this company has soughted third party help to retrieve some business information pertaining to this potential customers, including customer company revenue, customers' customers, customer credit/debit status...etc...

In this case, would you consider it as customer property even before any business transaction was being carried out?

Please share your thought...thanks.....:truce:

 

[harry]

Re: Clause 7.5.4 - How do you define Personal Data

.................. in order to assess the business risk of doing business with this potential customers, this company has soughted third party help to retrieve some business information pertaining to this potential customers, including customer company revenue, customers' customers, customer credit/debit status...etc...

In this case, would you consider it as customer property even before any business transaction was being carried out?

Please share your thought...thanks.....:truce:

What you described sounds like a preliminary study using information available to the public through the target company's fillings with the Registrar of Companies or Securities Commission if it is a listed entity. These are disclosures mandated by law and available for public consumption and hence not 'Customer Property'.

You may also use your business intelligence system to gather other facts not otherwise disclosed but these are your business secrets.

If you proceed further and are given the rights to conduct a business due diligence, then you are dealing with customer property and more - of course after having meet the necessary conditions and various undertakings.

 

[JaneB]

Re: Clause 7.5.4 - How do you define Personal Data

In this case, would you consider it as customer property even before any business transaction was being carried out?

No. Reason: as explained by Harry.

 

[QEC1989]

Re: Clause 7.5.4 - Can I exclude Customer Property?

Per the standard in clause 7.5.4...."The organization shall exercise care with customer's property while it is under the organization's control or being used by the organization"....don't forget things like the practice of safeguardiing customers' credit card numbers, shipping account numbers...things like that, if they apply to you.
These are often overlooked, but they are indeed customer-owned property.

 

[cheahga]

Re: Clause 7.5.4 - Can I exclude Customer Property?

Thanks for all your feedback.