Can I get Full PPAP approval when some components are at interim approval?

V

vardar3

#1
I have to submitt PPAP to a customer. Of the 21 components, three of them are at interim approval, due to them not being able to prove out capability.
  • The parts work fine in the assembly.
  • Can I submit PPAP with components at interim approval, and get full approval from my customer?
  • Is there a type of document (like deviation request) that can get me full approval despite my supplier interims?
 
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Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#2
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

I have to submitt PPAP to a customer. Of the 21 components, three of them are at interim approval, due to them not being able to prove out capabality.
  • The parts work fine in the assembly.
  • Can I submitt PPAP with components at interim approval, and get full approval from my customer?
  • Is there a type of document (like deviation request) that can get me full approval despite my supplier interims?
This will depend completely upon what your customer is willing to accept, and what their own PPAP requirements might be. In general, the answer is that components should be fully qualified at the time of submission of an assembly PPAP, but only your customer can say for sure.
 
V

vardar3

#3
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

Since our supplier issues are not going to get resolved by the PPAP deadline, do you suggest submitting a deviation request in any form, to the customer for these interim PPAP's parts, will that help in any way.
 

Howard Atkins

Forum Administrator
Staff member
Admin
#4
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

Do the deviations of the suppliers effect the customer requirements?

If you are 100% compliant with the customer in my mind there is no problem
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#5
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

Since our supplier issues are not going to get resolved by the PPAP deadline, do you suggest submitting a deviation request in any form, to the customer for these interim PPAP's parts, will that help in any way.
The best thing to do would be to discuss the issue with the customer. It might be that the customer would be willing to give you interim approval, or the customer, depending on circumstances not in evidence here, might be willing to grant full approval. My own experience has been that PPAP submissions with surprises in them are frowned upon by customers. If you aren't meeting the requirement, the basic rule is to inform the customer and go from there. From the AIAG PPAP manual, 4th Edition, page 4:

If any part specifications cannot be met, the organization shall document their problem-solving efforts and shall contact the authorized customer representative for concurrence in determination of appropriate corrective action.
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#6
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

Do the deviations of the suppliers effect the customer requirements?

If you are 100% compliant with the customer in my mind there is no problem
Yes, which is why I asked about the design responsibility for the components in question. If the assembly is defined by the customer only at the top level and the top level meets the requirements, there is no problem with submitting the PPAP or even divulging the component issues
 
V

vardar3

#7
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

You hit right on the bigger problem though. One supplier part is responsible for 4 significant characteristics on the top level assembly print, and they are not capable.

So I cannot submitt evidence to the customer that proves out the SC's. That is the main problem. We considered measuring parts in house and "massaging" the numbers, but I'm not going to do that. I think I need to come out with it that our supplier is not capable, and I cannot provide eveidence of it. how would I go forward with that? What do you think?
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#8
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

You hit right on the bigger problem though. One supplier part is responsible for 4 significant characteristics on the top level assembly print, and they are not capable.

So I cannot submitt evidence to the customer that proves out the SC's. That is the main problem. We considered measuring parts in house and "massaging" the numbers, but I'm not going to do that. I think I need to come out with it that our supplier is not capable, and I cannot provide eveidence of it. how would I go forward with that? What do you think?
If you're going by the AIAG default PPAP requirements, you need to put together an action plan and present it to your customer before your PPAP is submitted.
 
V

vardar3

#9
Re: Can I get Full PPAP approval when suppliers are at interim

Is that in PPAP 4th edition? I'm not familiar with it?
 
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