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Can PPAP be submitted when not all customer requirements can be met?

sinned

Registered Visitor
#1
I need help some advices on how to submitt PPAP when not all of the customer requirements are able to be met.

Lets say if we are a manufacturer and fails to meet some requirements on the print. Shall we communicate the issue to customer in advance and get their deviation approval first before we submit the PPAP package for approval -OR- we shall submit the PPAP and use it as a mean to notify customer to seek for their deviate acceptance ?

:confused:
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#2
I need help some advices on how to submit PPAP when not all of the customer requirements are able to be met.

Lets say if we are a manufacturer and fails to meet some requirements on the print. Shall we communicate the issue to customer in advance and get their deviation approval first before we submit the PPAP package for approval -OR- we shall submit the PPAP and use it as a mean to notify customer to seek for their deviate acceptance ?

:confused:
Do not submit PPAP documents, and then try to explain to the Customer why certain requirements were not met. Bad idea! Best thing to do is contact the "Authorized Customer Representative" prior to PPAP submission and explain the situation. State your issue and have a proposed plan of action in hand. Never contact the customer empty-handed.

Stijloor.
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#3
Do not submit PPAP documents, and then try to explain to the Customer why certain requirements were not met. Bad idea! Best thing to do is contact the "Authorized Customer Representative" prior to PPAP submission and explain the situation. State your issue and have a proposed plan of action in hand. Never contact the customer empty-handed.

Stijloor.
Yes. From page 4 of the 4th edition AIAG PPAP manual:

If any part specifications cannot be met, the organization shall document their problem-solving efforts and shall contact the authorized customer representative for concurrence in determination of appropriate corrective action.

The customer might, at that point, allow you to submit and might grant interim approval pending resolution of the nonconforming condition. In many cases tooling payments (if applicable) will be withheld until a full approval is granted, but you will (with interim approval) be able to ship product as specified by the customer.

If the customer does direct you to submit, get it in writing.
 

jerry_Malaysia

Quite Involved in Discussions
#4
I need help some advices on how to submitt PPAP when not all of the customer requirements are able to be met.

Lets say if we are a manufacturer and fails to meet some requirements on the print. Shall we communicate the issue to customer in advance and get their deviation approval first before we submit the PPAP package for approval -OR- we shall submit the PPAP and use it as a mean to notify customer to seek for their deviate acceptance ?

:confused:
Do not submit the PPAP.
Contact the customer and discuss the issue with them
I am not sure whether all customer practice the same, but all my customer will approve a "temporary adoption" or "waiver" form if they find that the deviation is acceptable.
 

andka907

Involved In Discussions
#5
Watch out! I have seen some updated CSR from OEM and 1st TIER that requires you to pay a fee when issuing a new PPAP if the first fails.

Example from one customer: 300€ plus tests required that the customer perform.
 
#6
Just to echo everyone else, it is definitely NOT in your best interest to submit a nonconforming PPAP without prior discussion with the customer.

Contact the SQE or equivalent at your customer, and explain the situation. Depending on the nature of the nonconformance, they may be prepared to accept the PPAP with a Deviation or Engineering Change Request, they may require changes in your process to bring you into compliance, or they may (not likely) be prepared to change their requirements to allow you to be conforming.

When you contact them, ensure that you have all the information that you need; why are you nonconforming, what are you doing to prevent nonconforming product being released, what will it take (and how long) to bring your process into conformance, what do you need from them to allow you to meet print requirements.
 
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