Churches Implementing ISO-Related Management Systems

[Sambasi]

The discussion in this forum is interesting.

Without offending anyone, I wish to add:-

The customers for a religious organization could the religious believers who are connected with it.

The purpose of a religious organization is to serve the believers / local community in an environment of friendship, love, support, understanding and prayer. The objectives could be to:-
• enhance faith on religion and god through the teaching and study of
religious books
• equip believers by encouraging spiritual and emotional growth
• improve communal harmony.

In a way this situation can be compared to an educational institution. The teachers in a college teach to improve the knowledge of students on a particular topic (which is already in existence). In a similar way a religious organization enhances the faith on religion and god for its believers ( who believe in their existance).

When viewed from this angle, the customers for a religious organization could its believers.

 

[Icy Mountain]

The customers for a religious organization could the religious believers who are connected with it.

Fascinating discussion!
If I read you correctly, you are talking about a value chain like this:
Deity as supplier, religious organization as distributor, individual believers as end users.
Or (since I don't expect to be simply a customer of a religious organization but also a highly involved partner),
Deity as design responsible organization, believers in the religious organization as both executors and customers of production and service provisions.

Non-believers would start as customers but could become production and service providers assuming that they achieve product realization.

 

[Sambasi]

Dear Icy Mountain,

Thank you for taking the discussions forward with your wonderful ideas.

With these the ideas generated in this thread, the requirements of ISO 9001 seem to be in place, when a religious organization intents to introduce QMS for its core activity.

 

[Sambasi]

The next question, in continuation of the current discussion could be “the relevance of ancient religious concepts to modern quality management principles”.

When it comes to problem solving techniques, I compare “Delphi’s 5-Why analysis” to “Buddha’s problem solving doctrine”. For posting in this thread, I prepared an attachment. The first page contains the features of “Delphi’s 5-Why analysis” and second page contains “Buddha’s problem solving doctrine”.The contents of second page are from internet-search and wickipedia.

The idea is to show the similarity between the both and not intended to propagate a religious idea.

 

[Jim Wynne]

The next question, in continuation of the current discussion could be “the relevance of ancient religious concepts to modern quality management principles”.

When it comes to problem solving techniques, I compare “Delphi’s 5-Why analysis” to “Buddha’s problem solving doctrine”. For posting in this thread, I prepared an attachment. The first page contains the features of “Delphi’s 5-Why analysis” and second page contains “Buddha’s problem solving doctrine”.The contents of second page are from internet-search and wickipedia.

The idea is to show the similarity between the both and not intended to propagate a religious idea.

It appears that we've now gone beyond the discussion of using ISO 9000 priniciples in churches (as in any other nonprofit organization) to discussion of purely religious stuff. I have it on good authority that the Flying Spaghetti Monster doesn't like ISO.

 

[EtobiLad - 2009]

Fascinating discussion!
If I read you correctly, you are talking about a value chain like this:
Deity as supplier, religious organization as distributor, individual believers as end users.
Or (since I don't expect to be simply a customer of a religious organization but also a highly involved partner),
Deity as design responsible organization, believers in the religious organization as both executors and customers of production and service provisions.

Non-believers would start as customers but could become production and service providers assuming that they achieve product realization.

I like your summation.

I've read in Quality Progress about healthcare, schools, and even professional soccer teams implementing management systems (some becoming registered to an ISO standard)....Would it be so far-fetched for churches to do the same thing?

Hey G,
Being a part of a developing assembly locally situated here in Toronto, I don't think having to implement a QMS within the organization (it is after all an organization) is far-fetched.
There is a policy ( or Mission, vision)
There are objectives (measurable as well)
There is definitely management responsibility
There are products
There are processes
and continual improvement
the list goes on to satisfying requirements

I suggest the pastor and the board to look into the system (ISO 9001:2000) but does not need to have a registration audit, unless money is not an issue with the members. Would it be beneficial, of course it is?

 

[ScottK]

Currrently an atheist, I can enjoy this thread from the QMS side only...

my goddess doesn't believe in atheists.

 

[Randy]

This has been a real good Thread because we've been exploring a really sensitive subject in a cooly professional manner. I personally like it.

I have a tendancy to view many things (shopping, restaurants, gov't agencies, hotels and the like) from the aspect of customer satisfaction and using the systems approach to achieve it.

In my seach for understanding business.....in the movie "12 Oclock High" Gregory Peck's character said that a Chaplin's business was sin, and from that statement, after I had heard it a hundred times, I grasped that a church could be viewed as a business needing sound business principles to succeed. From my revelation (no pun intended) I obtained a book " The Management Methods of Jesus" published by Thomas Nelson, Inc, 1996, ISBN 0-7852-7681-5. I also got a copy of "Moses on Management", published by Pocket Books (Simon & Shuster), 1999, ISBN 0-671-03260-7. Both of these books contained in their own way many of the things we have discussed and a bit more.

Like I said, interesting.

oh yeah, let's not forget: "Winnie-the-Pooh on Management" and "Leadership Secrets of Attila the Hun"