Clarifications on Lists, Logs and Registers

S

sharat_m

#1
Hi All,

We are a small software company with staff strength of 20. We are now getting prepared to be ISO 9001:2000 Certified by end of November. I was going through the topics in this forum and found them interesting. My interest is to know which of the following is a document, a record or none:

* Master list of Quality Documents - contains the list of controlled documents
* Master list of Quality Records - contains the list of controlled records.
* Task tracking sheet - contains the list of tasks in the project
* Test case Review log - contains the list of test cases documents and their review dates.
* Facility Service log - contains the service requests for various facilities in the office.

Thanks in advance for the time spent to understand my question and answering it.

Sharat .M
 
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S

SteelWoman

#2
Remember, to some extent at least, YOU get to decide the measure of control you exercise over documents. TS wants you to "establish criteria" for that control, which should of course be appropriate to your facility/operation. YOU decide what needs to be controlled, doesn't need to be in order for your quality system to operate effectively. Fer' instance: we define in our document control procedure that normally LOGS are not controlled documents here. We decided that on the basis of how the few logs we use are utilized AND based on our "criteria statement" for deciding whether or not a document should be controlled. But I know in some organizations logs are used differently, and their mis-use or "non-controlled" status would be problematic.

Bottom line: What makes sense for YOU?
 
#3
Hello Sharat, and welcome to the Cove. :bigwave:

Here is my take:

* Master list of Quality Documents - contains the list of controlled documents -Record.
* Master list of Quality Records - contains the list of controlled records. -Record
* Task tracking sheet - contains the list of tasks in the project - Record
* Test case Review log - contains the list of test cases documents and their review dates. -Record
* Facility Service log - contains the service requests for various facilities in the office. - Record

Steel provided good advice. pay attantion to what she said.

Another thing: Considering what you do for a living I suppose a computer based system would be nice?

/Claes

Added later: Sharat, Since you're going for ISO 9001 I moved this thread to the ISO900X forum. I think you'll get more answers that way.
 
Last edited:

Cari Spears

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
#4
SteelWoman said:
...Fer' instance: we define in our document control procedure that normally LOGS are not controlled documents here. We decided that on the basis of how the few logs we use are utilized AND based on our "criteria statement" for deciding whether or not a document should be controlled. But I know in some organizations logs are used differently, and their mis-use or "non-controlled" status would be problematic.

Bottom line: What makes sense for YOU?
Good example - we decided to control our log books as records (they are included in our Record Retention List) because they are critical records - especially in the repair end of our business. In addition - a current customer of ours requires us to retain an EDI log in sheet of their RFQ's and retain for one year.
 
T

tracey

#5
The way I look at it, a document that has not been filled out = a doucument; once it has been completed and information recorded on it, it is now a record. JMHO :)
 

howste

Thaumaturge
Super Moderator
#6
My take is a little different than that of Claes. Since the master lists of documents and records will be revised from time to time (as you add or change revisions), I would call them a document. Logs are a history, so they would be a record. For the task tracking sheet, I'm not sure. What is it used for? If it is subject to revision, and/or is used to provide instructions, I would call it a document. If it just shows what happened, it would be a record.

* Master list of Quality Documents - document
* Master list of Quality Records - document
* Task tracking sheet - ??????
* Test case Review log - record
* Facility Service log - record
 

Douglas E. Purdy

Quite Involved in Discussions
#7
Similar to Howste

Sharat M.,

I pretty much go along with Howste, but if the log is purely a management tool to know what is happening with the records, then it is not necessarily a record.

doug
 

Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#8
howste said:
My take is a little different than that of Claes. Since the master lists of documents and records will be revised from time to time (as you add or change revisions), I would call them a document. Logs are a history, so they would be a record. For the task tracking sheet, I'm not sure. What is it used for? If it is subject to revision, and/or is used to provide instructions, I would call it a document. If it just shows what happened, it would be a record.

* Master list of Quality Documents - document
* Master list of Quality Records - document
* Task tracking sheet - ??????
* Test case Review log - record
* Facility Service log - record
First a statement:
Records are merely a special form of document, not normally subject to revision because they represent the RECORD (history) of activities.

I agree with Howste to the extent that the two items he lists as documents because they are subject to revision is a fair statement. The last three items are records in my opinion, with this provision:
"as new or additional data is added to a record, it becomes a new record and the old (previous) one is obsolete and should be discarded if it is a paper printout."

Compare this concept to a continuing inspection log on a part which tracks inspections over the entire production period.
  1. Do we make a new revision of the log each time a new set of inspection results is added? (probably not.)
  2. Is a copy of yesterday's log valid if new info has been added today? (probably not and should be discarded.)
In essence, the date of the last entry in the log takes the place of the involved process of creating a new revision with checks and approvals normally required in a document control system.
 

Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#9
Wes Bucey said:
. . .
In essence, the date of the last entry in the log takes the place of the involved process of creating a new revision with checks and approvals normally required in a document control system.
I'm not sure I was clear in the "discard" aspect of my post. I referred only to the "copy" of the previous date of the record. In the case of computer entry, the previous material remains, course, as the history of what happened. In a machine shop, for example, the inspection record may be maintained on one sheet of paper, adding new entries at every inspection. Copies of the record through a certain date may have been made for different purposes. Once the new data is added to the record, the previously made copies are obsolete and may be discarded.
 

RoxaneB

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#10
sharat_m said:
Hi All,

We are a small software company with staff strength of 20. We are now getting prepared to be ISO 9001:2000 Certified by end of November. I was going through the topics in this forum and found them interesting. My interest is to know which of the following is a document, a record or none:

* Master list of Quality Documents - contains the list of controlled documents
* Master list of Quality Records - contains the list of controlled records.
* Task tracking sheet - contains the list of tasks in the project
* Test case Review log - contains the list of test cases documents and their review dates.
* Facility Service log - contains the service requests for various facilities in the office.

Thanks in advance for the time spent to understand my question and answering it.

Sharat .M
Like Claes pointed out, looking at your industry, what kind of document control system do you have? Is it primarily electronic? But here's my take...

Master list of Quality Documents
At my organization, our Document Control System is the list Master List of Documents. Controlled documents from external sources and controlled software have their lists maintain via a document (i.e, a work instruction) - listing name, rev#/date, location, person responsible for maintaining it. The Document Control System software can be found on the controlled software listing.

Master list of Quality Records
Within our Document Control System, there is a Records List module. Again, cound on the controlled software listing.

Task tracking sheet, Test case Review log, & Facility Service log
While blank, it a document called a form. Once there is data on it, it becomes a record.
 
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