Classifying findings as Major vs. Minor findings in the AS9100 world

[Bob the QE]

The age old question arises again, is it needed to classify findings as major vs. minor. I would like to stick to the AS world so as not to get to far off the pass. Our regristrar auditor in our doc review notes that in our internal audit procedure we "missed the definition of more important ones. Nonconformities - major and minor". I explained that my view is that a finding that is not in compliance to the standard is just that a finding. The degree of importance will be measured by our assessment to the impact of product, service or our QMS and will be elevated accordanly in our QMS system. I have not actually seen a definition of "Major or Minor" since I dealt with it back in the old 1994 ISO systems ( and as a group we defined that). Is there such a definition in AS world other than the one for non-conformities I am using from ANSI Q9000-2005?

I always learn something when I put stuff out here.

Thanks

 

[Coury Ferguson]

Re: Major vs Minor findings

Major: The absence of, or total breakdown of a quality management system element specified in the AQMS standard or any non-conformities where effect is judged to be detrimental to the integrity of the product, processes or service.

Minor: A single system failure or lapse in conformance with a procedure relating to the AQMS standard

Well, there is your definition. Judge for yourself.

 

[AndyN]

Re: Major vs Minor findings

Bob:

I feel you did the right thing and your desciption is more than adequate. Your registrar auditor is off base by making such a comment. I'm not in favor of grading internal audit nc's for reasons of subjectivity, etc. If it's something which management recognize needs fixing, they will get on with it, not because an auditor puts a check mark in a box.

 

[Stijloor]

Re: Major vs Minor findings

The age old question arises again, is it needed to classify findings as major vs. minor. I would like to stick to the AS world so as not to get to far off the pass. Our regristrar auditor in our doc review notes that in our internal audit procedure we "missed the definition of more important ones. Nonconformities - major and minor". I explained that my view is that a finding that is not in compliance to the standard is just that a finding. The degree of importance will be measured by our assessment to the impact of product, service or our QMS and will be elevated accordanly in our QMS system. I have not actually seen a definition of "Major or Minor" since I dealt with it back in the old 1994 ISO systems ( and as a group we defined that). Is there such a definition in AS world other than the one for non-conformities I am using from ANSI Q9000-2005?

I always learn something when I put stuff out here.

Thanks

When this topic "Minor and Major" nonconformities comes up during my training sessions, I respond that it does not matter if you have a big hole or a small hole in your car tire. Just fix the darn thing.... Too much time and energy are wasted on arguing this...

Stijloor.

 

[Jeff Frost]

Re: Major vs Minor findings

Ask you registrar auditor which sentence requires you to grade nonconformities as Major or Minor in Clause 8.2.2. Your registrar auditor is trying to apply the terms from the AQMS Certification/Registrations Programs Standard AS9104.

We have thanked our 2nd and 3rd party auditors for over eight years for their input on this issue and then say that for our internal audit system we take corrective action whenever we find nonconformity to the requirements of AS9100 or our own operational procedures or work instructions.

 

[windsal]

I agree that there is no need to classify the nonconformity for "major or minor". And I think this problem is just an opportunity to improve, but not a nonconformity. You can challenge with your auditor.

 

[Joy]

Hi,

There is a reference about this in AS9014, page 6 para # 3.9.But the document is applicable for auditors from ABs and CBs.

Major: The absence of, or total break down of a quality management system element specified in the AQMMS standard or any nonconformities where the effect is judged to be detrimental to the integrity of the product,processes or service.

Minor:A single system failure or lapse in conformance with a procedure relating to AQMS standard.


Hope this will help you.

Regards,
Joydeb

 

[Cari Spears]

We do not classify internal audit findings as major or minor either. There is no requirement for you to do so in AS9100.