Competencies: Education, Experience, Skills and Abilities

[RoxaneB]

Just stirring the pot a little bit...

It's 1230 am here and I'm about 1/2 way through my 12 hour shift. Note to self...be careful what you ask for, you may actually get it. Granted, it has been nice to get the entire week off (except for meetings) in lieu of the fact that I'm working 3 12-hour shifts this weekend on the floor...but, I can already feel the eyelids beginning to droop.

Anyway, getting back on topic, I must admit that I'm not a firm believer in job descriptions. I've lost track of countless times someone has replied to a request to perform a task, "Well, that's not in my job description." The usually way around this has been to add that catch-all phrase of "...and any other task requested by the supervisor." That tends to defeat the purpose of a job description, does it not?

At my organization, we tend to look at items such as job observations (following processes, safety protocols, etc.), nonconformances issued (against the crew), Customer Complaints (against the crew), scrap product, reworked product, delays, etc. When all is said and done, their job description should read "Do what is necessary, but in a safe manner, to get product out the door."

 

[Douglas E. Purdy]

A Nice Nebulous Job Description

RCBeyette:
When all is said and done, their job description should read "Do what is necessary, but in a safe manner, to get product out the door."

See your point! But instead of "Do what is necessary ... to get product out the door," maybe it should be "Be an Informed Team Player, Learn what is expected of you to meet the Team's Objectives, Perform your assigned responsibilities in a safe, efficient, and competent manner to ensure success for the company in meeting its business mission."

Doug

 

[RoxaneB]

See your point! But instead of "Do what is necessary ... to get product out the door," maybe it should be "Be an Informed Team Player, Learn what is expected of you to meet the Team's Objectives, Perform your assigned responsibilities in a safe, efficient, and competent manner to ensure success for the company in meeting its business mission."

Doug

While I don't necessarily disagree with you, I tend to prefer goals to ascertain my level of competency. Your nebulous job descritpion is a good start, Doug, but if I were an employee and told that that was how my competency would be assessed, my first question would be "How?"...followed by a quick "Against what levels?"

• What are the criteria that determine whether or not I am "informed" and a good Team Player?
• How am I to learn what is expected of me? Training? Who coordinates it? Me? My supervisor? On the job or overtime?
• Where can I find my assigned responsibilties?
• Where are the safety protocols?
• Define efficient and competent?
• What is the Company's Mission and how do I impact it?

If I am to attend certain training sessions over the year, I want to know up front what they are.

If I am to participate on x-number of teams per year, I want to know up front.

If I am to perform certain activities as part of my job, I need to know what they are from the beginning...and any safety protocols with them.

These are questions whose answers can be used to assess my comptency when requried. But then if we're too detailed, someone can refuse a task because "It's not in my job description". So in come the vague and meaningless phrases...and we're back to square one.

 

[Douglas E. Purdy]

Are there really levels of competency?

RCBeyette:
I tend to prefer goals to ascertain my level of competency.

A Dictionary Definition:
as·cer·tain ( P ) Pronunciation Key (sr-tn)
tr.v. as·cer·tained, as·cer·tain·ing, as·cer·tains
1. To discover with certainty, as through examination or experimentation. See Synonyms at discover.
2. Archaic. To make certain, definite, and precise.

I really did not mean to get into a philosophical discussion on competency, but I do not judge my level of competency purely by achieving goals that either I set for myself or someone else sets for me. Achievement is in the eye of the beholder. My competence is based on my abilities to understand what is expected of me (which is often a process of discovery) and how I can, or can not, meet those expectations. But then I was classified by my High School Guidance Counselor as a High Achiever - I appear to be driven to accomplish more than what I am actually capable of doing.

Are there really levels of competency, or are there levels of abilities? I would think that I am either competent or not competent to perform a task. The efficiency in which I accomplish that task, or the resulting effectiveness may not satisfy everyone, but the task is completed.

I was only responding to your

When all is said and done, their job description should read "Do what is necessary, but in a safe manner, to get product out the door."

. I was only attempting to turn your stated job description into a more self-actualizing purpose or objective. IMO the current Process Based Approach to implementing and maintaing a Quality Management System lends towards self-actualization of both the business and its owners and participants.

Your job description seemed to me to be too production oriented, for production's sake only, which would be understandable having to work 3 - 12 hour shifts on the floor.

Your nebulous job descritpion is a good start, Doug, but if I were an employee and told that that was how my competency would be assessed, my first question would be "How?"...followed by a quick "Against what levels?"

RCBeyette, would not your job description lead you to these same questions? I like your questions, and I anxiously await to read the responses on how we can detail one's functional responsibilities without the vague and meaningless phrases and not get the response "It's not in my job description".

Doug

 

[energy]

A little sand in the Cornflakes

http://elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?t=5562&page=1&pp=15&highlight=Competency

Just something else to think about...Personally, I resent any outsider questioning the methods of determining competency in a company that is sucessful enough to pay them for their services.

 

[Douglas E. Purdy]

Which are you serving?

Energy,

Which are you serving, sand or cornflakes? I like frosted corn flakes!

Is an outsider really questioning the methods of determining competency, or evaluating if an organization has determined the necessary competence for personnel performing work affecting product quality and provided training or taken other actions to satisfy these needs?

Resentment will not help in keeping an open mind to better understand what I might do to better the system. What I would resent is NOT having a common understanding or interpretation as to what or when is someone competent. Their definition is wide open!

9000:2000
3.9.12
competence
demonstrated ability to apply knowledge and skills.

Doug

 

[Greg B]

I don't know if this helps a lot but it is something I show people to help them understand Skills versus Work Instructions etc. It is still a WIP but shows that we must acknowledge those competencies and skills that people already possess (the reason we employed most of them). It then shows the Special skills that we will help them gain (Skills required to perform their Key Duties). It goes on to show the gap that Work Instructions fill (Checklists or info that is not required to be committed to memory, or must be followed to the letter).

The graph needs some work and should probably be more in the order of 60/30/10 or even 70/25/5. We need to record what skills a person requires for their job and frequency of retraining etc. (JMHO)

Greg B

 

[RoxaneB]

I really did not mean to get into a philosophical discussion on competency, but I do not judge my level of competency purely by achieving goals that either I set for myself or someone else sets for me. Achievement is in the eye of the beholder. My competence is based on my abilities to understand what is expected of me (which is often a process of discovery) and how I can, or can not, meet those expectations. But then I was classified by my High School Guidance Counselor as a High Achiever - I appear to be driven to accomplish more than what I am actually capable of doing.

But who is the beholder? Yes, the Beholder will be assessing your comptency level, to their requirements...so you may feel you are competent, someone else may feel differently. Which is why I prefer having the set guidelines upon which my comptency will be assessed down where they can not be argued. I either did or did not meet expectations...end of story.

Competency is not based solely upon your ability to understand what is required of you. It is also based upon your ability to deliever what you are expected to. A person may be a hard worker, but I prefer someone who works smart. I really get upset when people talk about all the overtime they've done, but if they would look at how they spent their time, the project possibly could have come in on time if they had prioritized properly, etc.

Are there really levels of competency, or are there levels of abilities? I would think that I am either competent or not competent to perform a task. The efficiency in which I accomplish that task, or the resulting effectiveness may not satisfy everyone, but the task is completed.

Effectiveness can play a part in assessing competency. Let's say John works at a full service gas station. I'm on a business trip, driving 2 hours to a meeting and notice I need gas. I pull in. John takes over 5 minutes to get out to my car. No explanation. No apology. I ask for Premium and he gives me Regular - granted I don't notice until I get the bill. When I go to pay by credit card, he comes back with no pen to sign the reciept. Finally, I'm pulling out of the station. John accomplished his task of providing me with gas...but is he competent?

I was only responding to your .

I realize that. I was probably attempting to mask my sarcasm, though, a method so widely used for demonstrating competency that can be completely meaningless if not used correctly.

I was only attempting to turn your stated job description into a more self-actualizing purpose or objective. IMO the current Process Based Approach to implementing and maintaing a Quality Management System lends towards self-actualization of both the business and its owners and participants.

It is a nice purpose, Douglas...but not an objective. Again, IMO, an objective will have a task, a level to meet, and a deadline.

Your job description seemed to me to be too production oriented, for production's sake only, which would be understandable having to work 3 - 12 hour shifts on the floor.

Naturally, they were production orientated based on my current focus. For the next two weeks, I'm shunning my desk job and am out on the floor. So let's look at some of my requirements...

• Development of PDCA Training Module by March 2003
• Development of Document Author Training Module by June 2003
• Development of Process Mapping Training Module by Sept 2003
• Development of ISO 14001 Internal Auditor Training Module by December 2003
• Development of plan to merge QMS/EMS by December 2003
• Internal Audits (Jan=0, Feb=1, Mar=0, Apr=0, etc)...and I am assessed on the adherence to the schedule
• Auditor Assessments (Jan=0, Feb=6, Mar=0, etc.)
• Response to Auditor Assessments completed within 30 days, where applicable

Job Descriptions should be based upon a person's job, should they not? If I am production, I would want to see activities, goals, etc. that my job impacted. If I am Administration, likewise.

RCBeyette, would not your job description lead you to these same questions? I like your questions, and I anxiously await to read the responses on how we can detail one's functional responsibilities without the vague and meaningless phrases and not get the response "It's not in my job description".

There will always be questions...but if the answers can be found somewhere, then the ability to assess comptency is not as difficult as we seem to be making it.

My Job Description should have detailed information on it regarding what I am responsible for. If it simply states "Follow suitable work instructions", then somehow I need to know which Work Instructions are applicable to me in order to know what I am supposed to do. If my Job Description states "Address Corrective Actions in a timely and effective manner", I need to know what the definition of 'timely' is and what is deemed to be 'effective'. If I am to accomplish a project, somewhere there needs to be plan showing deadlines and steps, etc., so that I know where I am supposed to be. If I am behind the deadlines, either I am incompetent or the schedule needs to be revised.

But my Job Description, if it will not tell me all that I need to know, should tell me where I need to go to get the full picture of what my competency will be assessed on.

 

[energy]

It's wide open

Energy,

Is an outsider really questioning the methods of determining competency, or evaluating if an organization has determined the necessary competence for personnel performing work affecting product quality and provided training or taken other actions to satisfy these needs?

Resentment will not help in keeping an open mind to better understand what I might do to better the system. What I would resent is NOT having a common understanding or interpretation as to what or when is someone competent. Their definition is wide open!

Doug

Ist paragraph....It doesn't matter whether he/she is evaluating or questioning. If I, as a Supervisor/Manager say my people are competent and I have it in writing (Any way I chooses to do it), "on to the next question, please".

2nd paragraph....my resentment for other people telling me that my methods of determining competency are flawed, would never display itself other than here in the Cove. We just smile and play the game. As I said before, the company's judgement of employees up to now, has allowed them to come up with the bucks to pay this yahoo. They certaintly aren't brain dead gas station attendants as described in R.C. Rebette's post.

 

[Raffy]

Hi Dave,
Basically, the competency requirement is not yet or shall we say not clearly specified on the
job description. So with the one you've discussed here, I think there's something lacking
on our specs. Btw, I still had some questions to add which I think would spice up more with
regards to competence: 1) What are the key results or outcomes for which the person
is responsible? - Does this mean a simple licensure examination would be needed here?
2) What evidence d you think is required to demonstrate competence? Do I still need to
start from scratch, wherein I have a job analysis to start with then define the corresponding
competence for the individual? And lastly, what method of measurement will be used
to obtain the evidence.

Thanks in advance.
Best regards,
Raffy