Conformal Coating & AS9102 - Is conformal coating material a COTS part

Mike S.

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#1
From a AS9102 FAI perspective, is the conformal coating material itself a COTS part to be listed on Form 1, or a Material that should be listed on Form 2?
 
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WNQuality

Starting to get Involved
#3
I would think conformal coating should be on Form 2. Form 1 is for PART NUMBER ACCOUNTABILITY whereas form 2 is PRODUCT ACCOUNTABILITY - MATERIALS, SPECIAL PROCESSES, AND FUNCTIONAL TESTING

I agree that CC is a COTS item, but it’s used as part of the manufacturing process that produces the items that go on Form 1. Additionally depending how it classified I would say CC is a special process.

If it was me I would list CC material and process on form 2 in block 5, 6, 8, & 10.
 

RCW

Quite Involved in Discussions
#5
My latest headache is similar to this. I have a product I am doing an AS9102 FAI for that requires that a primer and epoxy be applied. Those items are called out in the parts list on my customer's drawing. Okay, they are in the parts list, it's a "part" so put it on Form 1. The customer has come back to insist it belongs as a material on Form 2. I was under the impression that the materials on Form 2 were items such as aluminum stock, nylon block, brass, something that a manufacturing process is performed on, not glues, adhesives and the like.

Ironically, I found a PowerPoint online from the customer that gives the same examples I thought. Nothing about chemicals, glues and adhesives.

Is there any guidance on what constitutes a "material" to be listed on Form 2?
 

dsanabria

Quite Involved in Discussions
#6
From a AS9102 FAI perspective, is the conformal coating material itself a COTS part to be listed on Form 1, or a Material that should be listed on Form 2?

Form 2 if COTS are not modified - form 1

AS9102 Form 2
6. (CR) Specification Number: Provide the following information:
 Material specifications and material form (e.g., sheet, bar) for all materials incorporated into the FAI part (e.g., weld
or braze filler).
 Special process specifications; including class, if applicable, and permitted substitutions.
 If standard catalogue items (e.g., fasteners) or COTS are modified, then list that standard hardware or COTS item.
NOTE: Non-modified standard catalogue items are listed on Form 1, “Part Number Accountability”.
 

Mike S.

Happy to be Alive
Trusted Information Resource
#8
Rightly or wrongly, with input from some more experienced hands and from a Lockheed 2017 FAI "guidebook" I decided I would list on Form 2 items like conformal coating, epoxy, RTV sealant, solder, etc. as well as items like metal bar stock, and of course special processes.

I figure worst case the customer comes back and says something on Form 2 should go on Form 1 instead and so we fix it for them. I don't think most customers who ask for AS 9102 FAIs ever look at them beyond "yep, they supplied one, now file it away".

From what I have seen there is a tremendous amount of confusion about how to properly complete AS 9102 FAIs -- so much so that many companies publish their own guidance documents and/or training presentations to supplement the standard and help their internal and external folks to do them "properly" -- at least in their opinion. It would seem to me that some more complete examples from SAE would be very helpful, but being helpful and clear doesn't seem to be foremost in standard writers' minds, IMO.
 

dsanabria

Quite Involved in Discussions
#9
Rightly or wrongly, with input from some more experienced hands and from a Lockheed 2017 FAI "guidebook" I decided I would list on Form 2 items like conformal coating, epoxy, RTV sealant, solder, etc. as well as items like metal bar stock, and of course special processes.

I figure worst case the customer comes back and says something on Form 2 should go on Form 1 instead and so we fix it for them. I don't think most customers who ask for AS 9102 FAIs ever look at them beyond "yep, they supplied one, now file it away".

From what I have seen there is a tremendous amount of confusion about how to properly complete AS 9102 FAIs -- so much so that many companies publish their own guidance documents and/or training presentations to supplement the standard and help their internal and external folks to do them "properly" -- at least in their opinion. It would seem to me that some more complete examples from SAE would be very helpful, but being helpful and clear doesn't seem to be foremost in standard writers' minds, IMO.

Good job...
 
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