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Corrective Action - Superficial/No Internal Corrective Actions at all - Fineblanking


Steve Truchon

This is my first post. I was relieved to discover this forum. I have enjoyed reading all the posts.
Corrective Action: We are a fineblanking company with QS9000 reg since 1998. I am the new QE tasked with maintaining the QS. My audits have revealed corrective actions limited to Customer returns, Suppliers, and IA's, but no internal corrective actions at all. The CA's that do exist appear superficial in response to identified problems and there is no evidence of even a base knowledge of root cause analysis. This much is correctable through training and development (minor grimace), but Im afraid that due to what I'll call a lazy auditor from our registrar, there seems to be a lack of willingness internally to seek improvement in our CA process. No consequence = no change. Has anyone had experience in overcoming this type of challenge and if so, please share, I am all ears (eyes).

Jim Biz

Steve - Welcome to the mix.. would be curiouis as to "how" you found Marc's site?

I too am interested in finding "better ways" to use and upgrade the corrective action system we have.. you are not alone in what you are finding...

IMHO Best suggestion would be train-train-train -(I don't know where in this big world you are but you may wish to contact Marc to check out training services)...but that will only help to solve the issue IF/WHEN the cor-act system is understood - bought to focus & (driven for lack of a better word) by upper level management involvement.


[This message has been edited by Jim Biz (edited 12 July 2000).]

Daniel J. Rupright

The first step is to get a veteran employee from the floor in charge of corrective actions. They've been there, they know what's going on and not getting reported to management. They need to be organized and remain in friendly contact with all supervisors. Yes, you need to stop the rejections. After you get your corrective action system running, you'll know more and catch stuff early. This will improve customer relations also.

Daniel J. Rupright
Quality Cost Analyst
Defiance Metal Products Of Ohio

Steven Truchon

Originally posted by Jim Biz:

Steve - Welcome to the mix.. would be curiouis as to "how" you found Marc's site?

IMHO Best suggestion would be train-train-train
Thanks Jim.
I found the site from doing a HotBot search on the term "QS 9000". The "Cayman" term sparked my curiosity as I live fairly close to the Caymans and I plan to dive there soon.

I have to agree with the "train..." concept. I am working on a training focus for the mgmt above me as I will need their support to carry my plans and goals to completion.
Its interesting that a company can really achieve QS9000 registration with a documented system alone. If I were a third-party auditor, I would not approve my company because we are surface only with QS. I aim to do whats necessary to drive depth into this system but as I mentioned, I need horsepower from above so I think training for those residing above is step one.
Any thoughts on that perspective wiould really be welcome and interesting to me.


NOTE: Edited for html formatting.

[This message has been edited by Marc Smith (edited 12 July 2000).]

Laura M

We actually received a N/C for not having internal corrective action at one time. So you're probably on the right track. What do you make?

Actually have been to Lauderdale several ties that have since moved.
Loved it.


Captain Nice
Staff member
Originally posted by Jim Biz: may wish to contact Marc to check out training services
Hot damn! A real live 'plug'! Thanks!

See the 8-D file in the pdf_files directory for some thoughts on coredctive actions. Think Root Cause.

laura said: "We actually received a N/C for not having internal corrective action at one time.". Huh? Please explain.

Laura M

Marc, I was referencing the 1st post..late at nite, should have elaborated.

Back at previous full time employer before I ventured into the wonderful world of consulting, we had "internal rejects" from assembly areas back to fabrication areas. There were no documented corrective actions (5phase, 5-why, whatever...) on them. Actually as management rep, I was pretty p-----d off, because we had been after this particular department to start issuing CA's. Other departments were, and our procedures required it. Of course the 2 departments involved did the "not my fault" salute...."you didn't ask for an official CA" and "we shouldn't have to if its in a procedure" yada, yada yada...I just got to say "I told you so"

Anyway, the QS clauses referenced were 14.3 of the QSA..."Does the supplier use a disciplined problem solving method to address internal or external N/C's?"

So I think the original post is on the right track. A registrar, can look for CA's on internal problems, and write a NC if they don't exist.

Does that help?

Martijn TVM


Hum interesting because the company where I'm now uses the word Corrective Action alot. every internal screw up is solved with a corrective action which basically means giving some one a phone call to fix it.

So no written down confirmations or 8D's or anything. I'll propably solve this by changing all excesive CA's to just A.

You people think I can get away with that?

It is kinda out of the topic but any way.


Laura M

We ended up solving it by documenting "formal CA" in Pareto order.
The assembly areas 5 problems got addressed with formal problem solving. These were reviewed at CI meetings and once one was closed out, another one was added.

Martijn TVM

Thanks I was thinking of a similar solution and Formal CA sounds perfect to me. So for non-formal CA's there were no records right?

Now that's over on to the fun part (PPAP procedures it looks like a mess at the moment so let's try to cast some light in the darkness).
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