Creating an Internal Audit Schedule

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Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration with a Mask on...
Staff member
Admin
#32
The first attachment, below, is a condensed version of the requirements for quick reference and for discussion purposes.

The second attachment is a matrix to provide your with a methodology to factor in all the requirements including...
Are these in Excel? If so, any chance of your sharing the Excel files?
 

Sidney Vianna

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Staff member
Admin
#33
I too have looked at Patricia's chart and it certainly is a unique method, one I'm sure would knock the socks off most external auditors!
Why? I think it is an excellent tool. As I said elsewhere in this forum, planning the internal audit schedule, taking into account the status and importance of the processes is one of the most disregarded requirements of the ISO 9001 standard. Patricia's method is spot on. I wished most organizations would use a similar method. Internal audit resources are limited and should be deployed wisely.

For purposes of clarification on its use, I have some questions regarding the ranking system for the 'status' and 'importance' aspects. What is data is 'behind' the selection of the 1 = low etc.? Who comes up with these?

If we could get a bit more background to the selection of the rankings, I think it'd probably be an awesome tool and one most non-quality management would like to participate in.
I was just reviewing it and was wondering that too. Seems very subjective for the "status" portion. I can kind of understand the "importance ranking" but IA is listed as a 1...?
The document contains the following text:
In example below, process performance status is rated and weighted, giving more importance to customer-oriented processes and least to system oriented processes (Lead Auditor needs to rationalize importance ranking in their particular organization)
 

Patricia Ravanello

Quite Involved in Discussions
#34
Are these in Excel? If so, any chance of your sharing the Excel files?
Hi Marc...
I'm flattered :eek: by the request, and being of a generous nature, I thought, "Why not? :yes: and almost posted it...but then I thought, "No...:nope: I've already given enough away".

However, if anyone wants to purchase the "Excel" version, I'm sure that a more than reasonable price :cool: could be negotiated.

Regards,
Patricia
 
#35
Why? I think it is an excellent tool. As I said elsewhere in this forum, planning the internal audit schedule, taking into account the status and importance of the processes is one of the most disregarded requirements of the ISO 9001 standard. Patricia's method is spot on. I wished most organizations would use a similar method. Internal audit resources are limited and should be deployed wisely.

The document contains the following text:
Huh? Sidney, I was agreeing. Couldn't you hear me over there............??:rolleyes:

I agree the scheduling of audit is a poor relation in the overall scheme of things - too little emphasis is placed on this in auditor training
etc. So, that's why I thought Patricia's approach was so unique - no-one I've ever seen does anything close to this! So maybe I'll clarifyfor you....

THANKS PATRICIA, IT'S A GREAT TOOL AND I REALLY LIKE IT.........:lmao::lmao:
 

Sidney Vianna

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Staff member
Admin
#36
Huh? Sidney, I was agreeing. Couldn't you hear me over there............??
Sorry. I misread your post. But the eye-opener would not be limited only to 3rd party auditors. Most consultants and people implementing and maintaining ISO 9001 QMS's take a dumb approach of scheduling internal audits without due consideration of past history and criticality.
 
#37
But the eye-opener would not be limited only to 3rd party auditors. Most consultants and people implementing and maintaining ISO 9001 QMS's take a dumb approach of scheduling internal audits without due consideration of past history and criticality.
Sad, but so very true........and such an approach is ofen endorsed by third party auditors who when they see a schedule which emulates their own organization's approach (once a year, system wide, or every 'element' in 12 months etc.) they are happy......:bonk:
 
A

Ahoffman

#38
I did push back and it was probably the hardest that I had ever pushed back on any audit and apparently it worked as we received an excellent score. Whew!

Thanks to everyone for your input. We will be working on that schedule and develp a matrix as suggested by Colpart.
 

Patricia Ravanello

Quite Involved in Discussions
#39
I did push back and it was probably the hardest that I had ever pushed back on any audit and apparently it worked as we received an excellent score. Whew!

Thanks to everyone for your input. We will be working on that schedule and develp a matrix as suggested by Colpart.
Hi AHoffman...
I think that using a Matrix as you plan to do is reverting back to the "element-by-element" approach to auditing. When you created your system, you should have employed the methodology illustrated in the attachment "Covering all the Elements" and then extended it into the creation of your flow charts shown in the 1st attachment, then you would already know that your key processes have covered all the elements (and so would the auditors). You don't have to do it again....but I know, Auditors love to see that sort of matrix because it gives them some demented form of comfort. (If you're only doing it now, it's like you put the cart before the horse).

If they (the External auditors) had performed a "meaningful and comprehensive" Document audit during Phase One/Document Review for initial certification, they would never have to revisit that topic. The comprehensiveness of your system would have been confirmed at that time. Thereafter, just auditing your processes would ensure that you covered all the elements. The sad truth is that many auditors are still using the element-by-element approach.

Just trying to save you some work....I'm basically lazy, so I resort to all types of pre-emptive and/or preventive strategies to minimize future work.

...just MH (but candid) O.
Patricia
 

Attachments

P

Pazuzu - 2009

#40
Secondly, to address the "Performance Status" of the process, I use the data in my "Metrics DASHBOARD". It's a Metrics Database which I created, wherein each of the metrics in the company is linked to one of the 12 Key Processes. The metric's performance is assessed, at least monthly, and a performance "Status" is assigned, based on 3 factors:
1) Current Period Performance against Plan (or objective)
2) Year-to-Date Trend Performance
3) Projected Trend Performance for the next 4 months​

Based on company "Status" definitions of "Favorable" (Green), "Unfavorable" (Red) or "Needs Improvement" (Yellow), each metric is assigned a "Status". The respective metrics for each of the 12 Key Processes are then averaged together to give an overall "Performance Status" for that process. At the end of a 12 month cycle, the Process Performance is calculated for the past 12 month period, and a numerical value is associated with it for calculation purposes.

Since the standard expects you to consider "process status" as one of the factors to assess in setting your Audit Schedule, this was the best way I could see of doing that...and substantiating it mathematically...Most companies don't do it, and most Auditors don't ask how the Audit Plan was derived...and if they did, they would soon discover that, while some companies have a "partially justified rationale" for performing their audit...they will rarely find that all required criteria have been factored in.
Any chance you could depict how the dashboard works?? I've built my own audit summary similar to yours but capturing the ideas behind "status" would be awesome!!

:tg:
 
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