Databasing specifications and tolerances for mechanical products

apestate

Quite Involved in Discussions
#1
Hello everyone

Documenting specifications and tolerances is a monotonous task. Usually when a PPAP submission or Initial Sample Inspection Report is required by a customer, we have to label the specifications on the blueprint and list them on an ISIR form.

I have seen several spreadsheets that somewhat automate this task, nearly eliminating the waste of doing the data entry more than once. The Quality Manager would label the blueprint and enter the data into the spreadsheet. The data would link to the entire body of documentation needed for the part. The various sheets would be different tabs in the Microsoft Excel workbook.

The company I'm working for doesn't have such an elegant spreadsheet solution. We would like to create and utilize a solution like this.

There are a couple of issues that are unresolved with the basic spreadsheet PPAP/CP/FMEA/ISIR/Inspection Sheet package that I've seen people build. I think the majority of the difficulty rides on the array of specification and tolerance types that must be dealt with.

A "requirement" cell in one of these worksheets can have a lot of different types of data in it. Radius, angle, basic, linear dimension, range based on linear dimension, etc. This is not databasable, and that is the real goal.

I'm asking The Cove for help naming all the types of specifications and tolerances common to mechanical products.

I'll list them as I see it and attach a spreadsheet with the same.

Specifications:

Linear
Basic
Angle
Radius
Roughness
Standard
Custom

Tolerances:

Bilateral
Unilateral
Range
Minimum
Maximum
Geometric
Standard

Has anyone got ideas about how best to categorize, list, or otherwise handle the array of specifications and tolerances applied to mechanical product?
 

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CarolX

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#3
atetsade said:
Specifications:

Linear
Basic
Angle
Radius
Roughness
Standard
Custom
Diameter
Depth (as in counterbore or countersink)


atetsade said:
Tolerances:

Bilateral
Unilateral
Range
Minimum
Maximum
Geometric
Standard
Block
Other (as in +.005/-.020)

Just a few off the top of my head.
 

apestate

Quite Involved in Discussions
#4
Ah.

Thank you very much CarolX.

I think it would be helpful to add diameter, but in strict terms of data handling a numerical entry with appropriate tolerance would probably work.

This also applies to depth, but in this situation we come into another data handling problem. Chamfers, countersinks, and the like are often specified in strings of data.

It would be good to avoid splitting a chamfer into two requirements, for example:

"1" CHAM .1875 +.020/-.005 X 45 "2"

With data entry as follows:

cellA1 1 cellB1 .1875 cellC1 linear cellD1 bilateral cellE1 +.020 cellF1 -.005

cellA2 2 cellB2 45 cellC2 angle cellD2 bilateral cellE2 +.5 cellF2 -.5

It would be annoying to have to mark every single possible piece of data with a little circled number, because sometimes the specifications are strings of details. It's also a lot of data entry, but once it's there you have total power over it. The data entry could be finessed in many ways.

Let me ask, by Block do you mean tolerance block?

Let me also ask if you see where I'm going with this.
 
Last edited:

CarolX

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#5
atetsade said:
I think it would be helpful to add diameter, but in strict terms of data handling a numerical entry with appropriate tolerance would probably work.
This has always been an issue for me - so many features are not strickly numerical - what about drawing notes?


atetsade said:
It would be good to avoid splitting a chamfer into two requirements, for example:

"1" CHAM .1875 +.020/-.005 X 45 "2"

With data entry as follows:

cellA1 1 cellB1 .1875 cellC1 linear cellD1 bilateral cellE1 +.020 cellF1 -.005

cellA2 2 cellB2 45 cellC2 angle cellD2 bilateral cellE2 +.5 cellF2 -.5

It would be annoying to have to mark every single possible piece of data with a little circled number, because sometimes the specifications are strings of details. It's also a lot of data entry, but once it's there you have total power over it. The data entry could be finessed in many ways..
Annoying is an understatement. But for your application - it might work. In mine - it would make me nuts - I average 10 first articles a week - and we work to customer drawings - and everyone seems to have a different way of creating their drawings.


atetsade said:
Let me ask, by Block do you mean tolerance block?
Yep - block tolerances

atetsade said:
Let me also ask if you see where I'm going with this.
You want to standardize your reporting form - and create a "master" from which to work from. Great idea!
 

Caster

An Early Cover
Trusted Information Resource
#6
Marked Print?

atetsade said:
Hello everyone
atetsade said:

Documenting specifications and tolerances is a monotonous task. Usually when a PPAP submission or Initial Sample Inspection Report is required by a customer, we have to label the specifications on the blueprint and list them on an ISIR form.

I have seen several spreadsheets that somewhat automate this task, nearly eliminating the waste of doing the data entry more than once. The Quality Manager would label the blueprint and enter the data into the spreadsheet. .........Has anyone got ideas about how best to categorize, list, or otherwise handle the array of specifications and tolerances applied to mechanical product?


Atetsade

Years ago GM had the idea of a marked print, where we just neatly hand wrote the 5 measurements right on the print, with the bad ones in red.

There was a lot to be said for this, since it put the data right beside the reference. Saves going from a print out to the print, it's was all right there.

With Adobe pdf, I can imagine just adding a data layer to the print, could be very simple and effective to do.

Pretty sure the big 3 would never accept it though.
 

apestate

Quite Involved in Discussions
#7
Great idea, Caster.

With PDF, the big three would never have to know. You could layer your inspection sheet right over the print and hand the operator a clear print and an inspection sheet print.

I wonder how this will be done in 25 years, since it'll take that long to sharpen a pencil in some of these businesses. wow I almost lost it there.

Imagine a tablet PC with a blueprint displayed. By "scrolling" you can three dimensionally go through inspection sheet, control plan, fmea; material status, schedule, production etc.; work instructions, photos, quality records, and even all the rest.

But in the present, I think a databasable document pack could be done pretty well within Microsoft Excel.

Carol, I think notes would have to be addressed in the Custom category, and perhaps leave the ability to have a large description of the requirement. Verifications of notes are generally pass/fail so the tolerance would most often be attribute.

There are so many possibilities once the computer is utilized. There are vastly more possibilities once the requirements can be organized and categorized into discrete data. Imagine recording data from runs. If the data is handled correctly from the outset, there would be very few roadblocks to electronically recording.

I almost lost it earlier because I was thinking about all of the leeched-solvent-from-the-air, soot-stained, never used, 30-year-old sharpened pencils I've seen amongst the epic junk piles over the years.

Does anyone believe there will be a franchise factory chain in any country, ever?

WES WHERE'S YOUR INPUT ON THE DATABASING DIMENSIONS!?! Has this ever been done or tried? Is this already available in software?
 
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