Do we need to reference Standards in our Procedures?

GStough

Staff member
Super Moderator
#11
Re: Do we need to reference Standards into our procedures?

If you are making it a requirement of your system to follow some standard (whatever that standard may be...ISO, ASTM, SAE, whatever) then you should reference it in the Quality system somewhere, and you should have a current copy available...
We do reference standards in our quality manual and if it is necessary to reference these standards in any of our procedures, we word it something like this: "...as per standards as listed in the quality manual..." or something to that effect...

So, by identifying the standards once in the quality manual, this eliminates repetitive referencing of standards in various procedures, which would be a nightmare :mg: to update every time a revision was made to any of the standards.
 
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Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#12
Re: Do we need to reference Standards into our procedures?

We do reference standards in our quality manual and if it is necessary to reference these standards in any of our procedures, we word it something like this: "...as per standards as listed in the quality manual..." or something to that effect...

So, by identifying the standards once in the quality manual, this eliminates repetitive referencing of standards in various procedures, which would be a nightmare :mg: to update every time a revision was made to any of the standards.
You don't have to update individual procedures every time a standard changes if you don't reference the revision level of the standard in the procedure. That's the prime reason not to reference change levels. If you want to put something in the QM, just say that standards used must be the current ones.
 
S

sardonyx

#13
Thanks all for you inputs.
Right now, I'm trying to update the standards that our consultant used as reference in their procedure, product specs & requirements. Actually most of the documents we have that have reference standards are software docs (not manufacturing/testprocedures and not quality procedures) such as SRS (software requirements specs) SCMP (software control management plan), SDP (software development plan), software design description, software development procedure, etc.

Thanks again for enlightening me on how to start controlling these documents and standards. And maybe for new releases I'll make sure that they don't reference the standards in their documents if it's applicable.:thanx:or better to reference it from the QA manual (this is a good idea!).
 
C

cywork

#14
Hello, didn't mean to bring up an old post but this one is closest to what I am going to ask so here it goes:

Regarding referencing standards, if a standard has been cancelled but still used in the same drawing that has not been changed since before the cancellation is it ok to reference our procedures to this standard?

Per cancelled standards, replacement standards shall be used for future requirements so does that mean an outdated standard that is still being referenced by our customers is still considered ok? And do I need to reference the new standards at all?

We do adopt certain national standard procedures into our process in order to be compliant with customer requirements.

Thanks!
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#15
Hello, didn't mean to bring up an old post but this one is closest to what I am going to ask so here it goes:

Regarding referencing standards, if a standard has been cancelled but still used in the same drawing that has not been changed since before the cancellation is it ok to reference our procedures to this standard?

Per cancelled standards, replacement standards shall be used for future requirements so does that mean an outdated standard that is still being referenced by our customers is still considered ok? And do I need to reference the new standards at all?

We do adopt certain national standard procedures into our process in order to be compliant with customer requirements.

Thanks!
When two or more parties agree to use a given set of requirements, it's a standard whether or not it's been canceled by its publisher. Many companies still use MIL-STD-105x for acceptance sampling even though it was canceled many years ago.

In a similar vein, sometimes a mistake is made in calling out a specific version or edition of a standard on a drawing, which technically means that only the specified revision is valid even after it has been superseded. If there are substantive changes in a new revision in such a case, it's best to check with the customer for guidance. Unless there's a reason to specify a specific revision, it's best to state that it's expected that the latest version should be used.
 
R

Richard Pike

#16
Two part Answer: (1) If in your Policy (or other documentation)you state that you will comply to certain standards then most certainly you would be expected to have the latest revisions of those standards. (2) Whilst never advocating that we do something "simply because the standard says so" it is sometimes useful to know against what basis your procedures or instructions were written. If you are asking do you "always" have to cross refer then i agree with the moderator of this forum. Emphatically NO!
 
J

John Martinez

#17
Hello, didn't mean to bring up an old post but this one is closest to what I am going to ask so here it goes:

Regarding referencing standards, if a standard has been cancelled but still used in the same drawing that has not been changed since before the cancellation is it ok to reference our procedures to this standard?

Per cancelled standards, replacement standards shall be used for future requirements so does that mean an outdated standard that is still being referenced by our customers is still considered ok? And do I need to reference the new standards at all?

We do adopt certain national standard procedures into our process in order to be compliant with customer requirements.

Thanks!
There are many time, military especially, when they want a specific standard AND revision for a specific part. So, even though the standard has been canceled or revised, you can still work to the old standard if agreed.

Many times dealing with government buyers, it's easier to just provide the part to the older standard (if possible) than going through the head banging process of trying to educate them. :frust::frust::frust::frust:
 
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