Do you have to perform an full internal prior to IATF 16949 audit?

hngrad1977

Starting to get Involved
#1
My auditor is writing me a major non-conformance because we did not perform a full internal audit to the new standard before the registration audit. I do not see in the standard where it says I have too. Has anyone else ran into this? My auditor is here now,
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor
#3
My auditor is writing me a major non-conformance because we did not perform a full internal audit to the new standard before the registration audit. I do not see in the standard where it says I have too. Has anyone else ran into this? My auditor is here now,
They are wrong (unless it's in your CB agreement) Ask them to point to the requirement...
 

Golfman25

Trusted Information Resource
#4
Auditing doesn't happen in a vacuum. You're auditing, revising, auditing, revising, etc. You simply should ensure you have audited any changes before the third party audit. Is this an IAFT 16949 audit?
 

Cari Spears

Super Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
#5
hi, hngrad -

I checked out your other posts and see that you mention you're working on IAFT 16949 - so I moved your thread to this forum to help get more responses. Let me know if I presumed incorrectly.
 
Last edited:
#6
My auditor is writing me a major non-conformance because we did not perform a full internal audit to the new standard before the registration audit. I do not see in the standard where it says I have too. Has anyone else ran into this? My auditor is here now,
The requirements for audits have changed, but not dramatically, unless you were not meeting the TS requirements. What I mean by that is, if you had an internal audit program and were already doing internal audits, checking on the various processes, looking at document control, records (maybe even using turtles) you DO NOT have to do everything all over just the meet IATF requirements, because you ALREADY were!

All that's required - trust me - is to audit the new and changed requirements to establish the system as a whole now meets IATF. It's certainly NOT justifiable as a major maybe a minor at best. Don't argue with the audit, don't agree to the finding and tell them you will be appealing it with the CB management and requesting a change of auditor - pure and simple.
 

hngrad1977

Starting to get Involved
#8
The auditor is firm in saying IATF Global Oversight board requires it and it is our responsibility to go out to the site and verify these requirements. I have the rules and guidelines but have never heard of this
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#9
The auditor is firm in saying IATF Global Oversight board requires it and it is our responsibility to go out to the site and verify these requirements. I have the rules and guidelines but have never heard of this
From the IATF 16949:2016 Transition Strategy Revision 5:

Are organizations required to conduct a full internal system audit
against IATF 16949 prior to the start of the transition audit?

The organization is required to demonstrate compliance to IATF 16949:2016 through a complete internal system audit against the requirements of IATF 16949:2016 prior to the transition audit conducted by an IATF-recognized certification body. This should be demonstrated through a complete full system audit against IATF 16949:2016. However at the time of the transition audit this may be accomplished through the combination of a previous system audits with the ISO/TS 16949:2009 requirements and a supplemental system audits in compliance with the additional requirements of IATF 16949:2016.
Here is a link to the entire document.

http://www.iatfglobaloversight.org/...ransition-Strategy-and-Requirements_REV05.pdf
 

hngrad1977

Starting to get Involved
#10
I follow the IATF 16949 standard, APQP, FMEA and all of the other blue books, but have never been told I had to go to the IATF Global Oversight.org and look for that information. If that is the case I find it hard to believe hardly anyone would know this. It may make good business sense to do it but in reality why a major?
 
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