Document Numbering System For ISO/Quality Management Document vs. All Other Documents

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mattador78

Quite Involved in Discussions
#42
No, old bills aren't allowed to circulate forever (at least here in the US and in the UK). If it's a $20US then if it doesn't pass the pen test (counterfeit testing - which the previous ones don't) you can't use them. The serial number is a counterfeiting control, nothing to do with revision control, since you nor I can tell what we've got from that number alone. The "worth" of the bill isn't the point of discussion. It's whether you a) need to identify documents by a complex numbering system and if a revision number is needed for effective document control - to which my answer (based on 40 years of doing such systems) - is "no". I can't answer for any CB auditor of course, except to say that I've audited countless document control systems such as you espouse and commonly find they are ineffective because those "hall marks" may confuse some auditors, but they don't make effective controls.
Correct Old notes don't circulate for ever in the UK. In theory we have a revision system whereby every so many years we replace a note with a new icon on the back for example now on the new £5 polymer notes we have Winston Churchill prior to that we had Elizabeth Fry and George Stephenson (which in themselves the new polymer notes could be a revision). When the new notes are released the previous editions are recalled into banks over a period of time and cease to be legal tender. They can however be replaced by banks for the new notes at any period if you find on in an old piggy bank somewhere 10 years later.
 
Last edited:

Sebastian

Trusted Information Resource
#43
Interesting. Most numbering systems I see divide procedures, work instructions, etc, by DEPARTMENT.


Your doc numbering system however relates to the MACRO-PROCESSES.
Our previous document numbering system was based on code of department who create it, and code of document group, e.g. procedure, instruction, record.
To promote process approach, we've changed to code of related process and resign from document groups, just used alphanumeric consecutive numbering.
 
#44
Exactly so, Mattador! I stopped holding on to my GB money in case it was revised - especially since shops won't take old paper money and I don't want to stand in a queue at a bank!
 

rogerpenna

Involved In Discussions
#45
Re: Document Numbering System For ISO/Quality Management Document vs. All Other Docum



It doesn't matter a Tinkers dam (got to be able to show revision status though)
(I have a couple clients that do just that and they have no problem) But it's so simple most "professionals" go "Duh"
If you just have a title, then there is danger of documents being created with the same title, by different departments. I think that is the main reason.
 
#46
BEST PRACTICE Ever...where you can see traceability like what procedure does this work instruction or forms belongs to.

DCN=Document Code Number

AAAA-BBC-NN-DNN
Where,
AAAA, company name acronyms
BB, section name or department
C, level 1 & 2 documents (M-manual, P-Procedure)
D, level 3 documents (W-work instructions, F-forms, R-records, G-guidelines, P-policy)
NN, number series which starts from 00 to 99


Header of the document-sample:

Procedure for Control of Documented Information
DSPI-EQP-01 / Rev.00 / W.e.f. 22-Sep-2021

Work Instructions for Coding and Filing Management of Documented Information
DSPI-EQP-01-W02 / Rev.00 / W.e.f. 22-Sep-2021

Title of Forms-sample:

Document Change Request
DSPI-EQP-01-F02 / Rev.00 / W.e.f. 22-Sep-2021

Document Code, Revision Number and "W.e.f.- With effectivity from" were always under the Title of the documents or forms... not somewhere else...and it was in every header in Left alignment beside the company logo.


For Level 1 & Level 2 documents:
DSPI-EQP-01 this procedure no 1 "P-01" belongs to company "DSPI" for section "EQ" Quality and Environmental Management System Team
More Ex...
DSPI-QAP-01, DSPI-PLP-01 (QA-Quality Assurance Section, PL-Planning section)

DSPI-EQM-01 this manual no. 1"M-01" belongs to company "DSPI" for section "EQ" Quality and Environmental Management System Team
More Ex...
DSPI-ACM-01, DSPI-ITM-01 (AC-Accounting, IT-Information technology)

For Level 3 documents:
DSPI-EQP-01-F01 this form no. 1 "F01" belongs to "Procedure for Documented Information (DSPI-EQP-01)"

DSPI-EQP-01-W01 this work instruction no.1 "W01" belongs to "Procedure for Documented Information (DSPI-EQP-01)"
 

Andrei77

Starting to get Involved
#47
BEST PRACTICE Ever...where you can see traceability like what procedure does this work instruction or forms belongs to.

DCN=Document Code Number

AAAA-BBC-NN-DNN
Where,
AAAA, company name acronyms
BB, section name or department
C, level 1 & 2 documents (M-manual, P-Procedure)
D, level 3 documents (W-work instructions, F-forms, R-records, G-guidelines, P-policy)
NN, number series which starts from 00 to 99


Header of the document-sample:

Procedure for Control of Documented Information
DSPI-EQP-01 / Rev.00 / W.e.f. 22-Sep-2021

Work Instructions for Coding and Filing Management of Documented Information
DSPI-EQP-01-W02 / Rev.00 / W.e.f. 22-Sep-2021

Title of Forms-sample:

Document Change Request
DSPI-EQP-01-F02 / Rev.00 / W.e.f. 22-Sep-2021

Document Code, Revision Number and "W.e.f.- With effectivity from" were always under the Title of the documents or forms... not somewhere else...and it was in every header in Left alignment beside the company logo.


For Level 1 & Level 2 documents:
DSPI-EQP-01 this procedure no 1 "P-01" belongs to company "DSPI" for section "EQ" Quality and Environmental Management System Team
More Ex...
DSPI-QAP-01, DSPI-PLP-01 (QA-Quality Assurance Section, PL-Planning section)

DSPI-EQM-01 this manual no. 1"M-01" belongs to company "DSPI" for section "EQ" Quality and Environmental Management System Team
More Ex...
DSPI-ACM-01, DSPI-ITM-01 (AC-Accounting, IT-Information technology)

For Level 3 documents:
DSPI-EQP-01-F01 this form no. 1 "F01" belongs to "Procedure for Documented Information (DSPI-EQP-01)"

DSPI-EQP-01-W01 this work instruction no.1 "W01" belongs to "Procedure for Documented Information (DSPI-EQP-01)"

Thank you for sharing this system with us.

I`ve got one question though, what is the difference between a Form & Record? In my experience Record is a Form filled in, completed with the required information. So, does this mean as per your example, if you fill in a Document Change Request which is form DSPI-EQP-01-F02 / . . . it becomes then DSPI-EQP-01-R02 / . . . ? Or do you have a different definition of Record?
 

Thee Bouyyy

Multiple Personalities
#48
if you fill in a Document Change Request which is form DSPI-EQP-01-F02 / . . . it becomes then DSPI-EQP-01-R02 / . . . ?
I guess there's little confusion here. Two things mixing up. One is document number (Form number) and once that filled form becomes record thn it should have report number.

So, DSPI-EQP-01-F02 remains the same having report number. I don't think so it should be DSPI-EQP-01-R02. It's so complicated. Sorry.
 

John Broomfield

Staff member
Super Moderator
#49
Thank you for sharing this system with us.

I`ve got one question though, what is the difference between a Form & Record? In my experience Record is a Form filled in, completed with the required information. So, does this mean as per your example, if you fill in a Document Change Request which is form DSPI-EQP-01-F02 / . . . it becomes then DSPI-EQP-01-R02 / . . . ? Or do you have a different definition of Record?
You are correct.

Records are usually controlled by their content including: unique identifiers, date, name, etc…

…not by their document code, so superseded documents become records too.

Refer to your filing and archiving process.
 
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