Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10.2.4

kylerf

Involved In Discussions
#1
Would FMEAs for each part settle the requirements of having a documented problem solving and documented error-proofing process?

or is IATF wanting specific documented procedures on these?

Thanks for your help!
 

AndyN

A problem shared...
Staff member
Super Moderator
#2
re: Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10.2.4

Would FMEAs for each part settle the requirements of having a documented problem solving and documented error-proofing process?



or is IATF wanting specific documented procedures on these?


Thanks for your help!
FMEAs are neither problem solving nor error proofing processes...
 

Miner

Forum Moderator
Staff member
Super Moderator
#3
Re: Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10

To clarify, FMEAs are tools that are primarily used to identify and mitigate potential risk. Error proofing may occur as part of a risk mitigation action or as part of a corrective action arising from a problem solving process, but FMEA is not an error proofing process.
 

kylerf

Involved In Discussions
#4
Re: Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10

How so?


I believe that error proofing and problem solving can be implemented and intertwined with the FMEA process. For example, you analyze failure modes and give potential causes and reaction plans to prevent it from happening and from reoccurring. Is this not what error proofing and problem solving is?





If i am wrong, what can we do to satisfy this IATF requirement?
 

AndyN

A problem shared...
Staff member
Super Moderator
#5
Re: Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10

To do "problem solving" don't you have to have had a problem? Doing an FMEA is supposed to prevent problems. Prevention isn't solution.
 

kylerf

Involved In Discussions
#6
Re: Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10

Yes your'e correct, but "problem solving" would then reflect back to our corrective action process with root cause analysis and corrective action, wouldnt it?
 

AndyN

A problem shared...
Staff member
Super Moderator
#7
Re: Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10

They are one and the same thing. Taking (effective) corrective action, solves problems.
 

AMIT BALLAL

Quite Involved in Discussions
#8
Re: Documented problem solving and documented error-proofing - IATF 16949 10.2.3 & 10

After risk assessment using FMEA, you might need to implement error proofing in order to reduce occurrence / to improve detection.

During problem solving against a customer complaint / internal nonconformity, you might identify the need to provide error proofing (Occurrence / detection).

Both of the above approaches you can add in the documented process for error proofing, as required by the standard.

FMEAs can't be considered as a part of problem solving, since FMEA is a proactive approach, whereas problem solving is reactive approach.
But you'll have to revise FMEAs against customer complaints to incorporate the actions taken.

You'll have to prepare documented process for error proofing and problem solving both (separately / combined in a single process). FMEAs won't fulfill the requirement of these documented processes. You can use FMEAs to demonstrate compliance to how you've implemented error proofing / problem solving process.
 
Last edited:
Top