Ethics and Quality Management

Rate the expected ethics at companies you worked for

  • Expected to lie and fudge on anything and everything

    Votes: 2 14.3%
  • Expected to fudge frequently

    Votes: 6 42.9%
  • Expected to fudge on rare occasions

    Votes: 3 21.4%
  • Would be in trouble if I fudged

    Votes: 3 21.4%

  • Total voters
    14
G

gregfish

#1
I am very interested in what percentage of quality professionals are asked to "fudge" data in the interest of their company. I have worked for companies that vary from being very serious about ethics to others that expect you to lie and fudge data and if you didn't, they would find someone who would.

Poll Ratings Are:
1 = Expected to lie and fudge on anything
2 = Expected to fudge frequently
3 = Expected to fudge on rare occasions
4 = I would be in trouble with my company if I fudged anything

Also, a similar question is - when interviewing with a company for a job, what questions would you ask to really get a feel for how they stand on ethics.

Thoughts everyone??
 
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Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#2
I am very interested in what percentage of quality professionals are asked to "fudge" data in the interest of their company. I have worked for companies that vary from being very serious about ethics to others that expect you to lie and fudge data and if you didn't, they would find someone who would.

Poll Ratings Are:
1 = Expected to lie and fudge on anything
2 = Expected to fudge frequently
3 = Expected to fudge on rare occasions
4 = I would be in trouble with my company if I fudged anything

Also, a similar question is - when interviewing with a company for a job, what questions would you ask to really get a feel for how they stand on ethics.

Thoughts everyone??
Serious answer: I am NOT the kind of person anyone would ask to fudge something (I'm pretty sure I understand what YOU mean by fudge, but perhaps you ought to define the term exactly for some of our folks unfamiliar with American slang.)

That is not to say that folks have never tried to fudge things behind my back. Even so, I am not the scream and shout type of guy who screams , "Wrong! Wrong!" if I learn about fudging. I usually go into "didactic" mode to explain how the short-term gain from fudging is often outweighed by long-term consequences when and if it is discovered or detected. Then we go about unwinding the fudge. (Kind of like a mom taking the shoplifting kid back to the candy store to apologize and make amends.)

Because I am always up front about "tell the truth and you won't have to remember lies" AND I follow Deming's precept about removing fear from the workplace, most folks don't feel they have to fudge (especially quality records) to keep from getting punished.

I'm not sure any of the poll choices fit my situation. What would you suggest? [Do not tell me to fudge my answer;)]
 

harry

Super Moderator
#4
........I have worked for companies that vary from being very serious about ethics to others that expect you to lie and fudge data and if you didn't, they would find someone who would..................... Also, a similar question is - when interviewing with a company for a job, what questions would you ask to really get a feel for how they stand on ethics.

Thoughts everyone??
'Birds of a feather flocked together' - the ethical types will quickly quit leaving behind the unethical ones and the 'couldn't care' types.

I supposed the most you can ask during a job interview is whether they have ethics committee or policy but then we also have recent cases of the ethics committee not practicing what they preach.

In my opinion, feedback from people who deal with them such as suppliers, contractors or employees from the middle to lower levels could be a better and more accurate way to judge them.
 
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Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#5
"Fudge Factor" is different from the type of "fudging" referred to here. In this context, "fudge" is a verb synonymous with "falsify."

I think it would be pretty unusual for anyone with a fair amount of experience in quality to not have seen it, or done it, to one extent or another. I've had times when I was asked to do it and refused, and no one ever asked me again--although they might have sidestepped me. On the other hands, I was in one situation where it became clear that dishonesty was so ingrained in the company that I just got the heck out at the first opportunity.
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#6
"Fudge Factor" is different from the type of "fudging" referred to here. In this context, "fudge" is a verb synonymous with "falsify."

I think it would be pretty unusual for anyone with a fair amount of experience in quality to not have seen it, or done it, to one extent or another. I've had times when I was asked to do it and refused, and no one ever asked me again--although they might have sidestepped me. On the other hands, I was in one situation where it became clear that dishonesty was so ingrained in the company that I just got the heck out at the first opportunity.
Yes, I know what you mean. However, I did a search on "fudge", and not much in terms of what your could call "falsify" turned up. Most of had to do with something high in calories....:D Any place where I should have looked? I am traveling, so I had to leave my trusty dictionary behind.

Stijloor.
 

BradM

Staff member
Admin
#7
I have been fairly fortunate that I have avoided companies that really put pressure to fudge. If they did, I probably would not have worked there for very long.

I wonder if you could correlate employees perception of 'fudging' with mangement ethics and/or views of the QMS. That would be kind of fun.
 

harry

Super Moderator
#8
Yes, I know what you mean. However, I did a search on "fudge", and not much in terms of what your could call "falsify" turned up. Most of had to do with something high in calories....:D Any place where I should have looked? I am traveling, so I had to leave my trusty dictionary behind.

Stijloor.
You may want to look at Answers (dot) com.

Interesting 'slang' interpretations can be found in the 'urbandictionary dot com'.
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#9
Interesting 'slang' interpretations can be found in the 'urbandictionary dot com'.
There's an interesting note on the bottom of their web page:

Urban Dictionary is not appropriate for all audiences. :D

Thank you Harry.

Stijloor.
 

Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#10
By Jove! Harry has outstripped Stijloor in the "google me an answer" competition:applause:

Yep. For all of us who are native American slang slingers, "fudge" as a verb means to fake or falsify the facts - for the rest of you folks, fudge, the noun, is a delicious confection sold in all the finer tourist traps in America. I'm partial to the chocolate with pecans variety myself.
fudge (fŭj)
n.
  1. A soft rich candy made of sugar, milk, butter, and flavoring.
  2. Nonsense; humbug.
v., fudged, fudg·ing, fudg·es. v.tr.
  1. To fake or falsify: fudge casualty figures.
  2. To evade (an issue, for example); dodge.
v.intr.
  1. To act in an indecisive manner: always fudged on the important questions.
    1. To go beyond the proper limits of something: fudged on the building code requirements.
    2. To act dishonestly; cheat.
[Possibly alteration of fadge, to fit.]
I guess no one ever approached me to fudge facts because I am the up front type of guy who makes his position clear from the outset and carry the kind of gravitas that makes me appear pretty uncorruptable.

My refusal to fudge, however, does not keep me from "spinning" a story about bad situations to make them appear in a better light (what some call "unmitigated disasters" are something I might spin as "great opportunities for learning how to improve our process.")

Added in edit:
When someone uses the phrase, "Oh fudge!" as an epithet, it is "code" for an obscene word also beginning with F.
 
Last edited:
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