File tracking and revision maintenance

[MEldy]

Hi,

My job is level desk side support and we recently working with a ISO expert in my department and well it would be good if I could reply in ISO language to a not very pleasant email concerning ISO 9001 standards.
My question is can a pdf /form/contract/whatever be replaced or it can only be edited to maintain the ISO 9001 standard ?

This is what I emailed the user

[FONT=&quot]"I strongly advised to use the original word file, do the change, save as pdf and replace the older pdf version in e-room. PDF software does not replace MS Word. You should have a access to a shared folder in e-room with all the pdf files in their original Word/Excel format. Nitro pdf is not to be used as a word processer"[/FONT]

This is what I got from our resident ISO Expert

"Our ISO 9001 processes require strict document management and control, if you are not familiar with these processes, please do not instruct the users as you did."

Thanks,

Meldy


Any suggestion would be very much appreciated.

 

[isotexas]

Hi Meldy,

Without knowing the specifics about your document control process, it is hard to give you the proper infomation.

From what you have written and what the repsonce was, I assume that your organization has a "point of issue" department that "releases" your documentation changes.

I don't know who your original email was sent to or whether they have issue authority, but if they didn't, they shouldn't be "replacing" any documentation.

One suggestion that I can make for certain, read all your document control procedures and see if you can find the requirement that your ISO expert objected to. If all else fails, ask her to help you understand the process.

Hope this helps

Susan in Texas

 

[Jim Wynne]

Hi,

My job is level desk side support and we recently working with a ISO expert in my department and well it would be good if I could reply in ISO language to a not very pleasant email concerning ISO 9001 standards.
My question is can a pdf /form/contract/whatever be replaced or it can only be edited to maintain the ISO 9001 standard ?

This is what I emailed the user

[FONT=&quot]"I strongly advised to use the original word file, do the change, save as pdf and replace the older pdf version in e-room. PDF software does not replace MS Word. You should have a access to a shared folder in e-room with all the pdf files in their original Word/Excel format. Nitro pdf is not to be used as a word processer"[/FONT]

This is what I got from our resident ISO Expert

"Our ISO 9001 processes require strict document management and control, if you are not familiar with these processes, please do not instruct the users as you did."

Thanks,

Meldy


Any suggestion would be very much appreciated.

Welcome to the Cove, Meldy.

I'm not sure what the issue is. You're job is "level desk side support"? What does this mean? How are you connected to document control issues? Can you provide more detail about the type of changes you're referring to? Have you discussed this with your "resident ISO Expert"?

 

[MEldy]

Welcome to the Cove, Meldy.

I'm not sure what the issue is. You're job is "level desk side support"? What does this mean? How are you connected to document control issues? Can you provide more detail about the type of changes you're referring to? Have you discussed this with your "resident ISO Expert"?

I do end user support for a large corporation in Toronto. This one user is trying to edit a 40 page pdf document. Its like being back in 1981 with Wordstar so I'm just trying to see if we can still be ISO 9001 compliant and offer a way around editing a pdf file by offering the document in its native format for revision purposes. Or is it that what he says to me make no sense, so therefore my question makes no sense ?

 

[Jim Wynne]

I do end user support for a large corporation in Toronto. This one user is trying to edit a 40 page pdf document. Its like being back in 1981 with Wordstar so I'm just trying to see if we can still be ISO 9001 compliant and offer a way around editing a pdf file by offering the document in its native format for revision purposes. Or is it that what he says to me make no sense, so therefore my question makes no sense ?

End user support of what? Is this IT support? It sounds like a user is trying to edit/change a controlled document, and your ISO expert suggested that the advice you gave in that direction wasn't in line with your company's document control process. If that's the case, you really should learn more about the process so as to avoid giving authoritative advice that results in users violating the rules.

 

[MEldy]

Thanks for the reply,

I wasn't clear, yes it IT end user support and she the one "controlling the document" or the "revisionist of it" if you want. So I don't see where I promoting "end users violation", really? So I gather "a controlled document"
is a ISO buzz word and most likely opened to different interpretations.

Meldy

 

[Jim Wynne]

Thanks for the reply,

I wasn't clear, yes it IT end user support and she the one "controlling the document" or the "revisionist of it" if you want. So I don't see where I promoting "end users violation", really? So I gather "a controlled document"
is a ISO buzz word and most likely opened to different interpretations.

Meldy

"Controlled document" is more than an "ISO buzz word" and if your company's QMS is properly designed, the phrase should not be open to interpretation. I strongly suggest that you learn more about not just the document control system, but the quality management system in general at your company.

 

[MEldy]

Hi Meldy,

Without knowing the specifics about your document control process, it is hard to give you the proper infomation.

From what you have written and what the repsonce was, I assume that your organization has a "point of issue" department that "releases" your documentation changes.

I don't know who your original email was sent to or whether they have issue authority, but if they didn't, they shouldn't be "replacing" any documentation.

One suggestion that I can make for certain, read all your document control procedures and see if you can find the requirement that your ISO expert objected to. If all else fails, ask her to help you understand the process.

Hope this helps

Thank you Susan,

Your comment got the ball rolling and now I'm requesting a document control procedures manual from him. The thing is our level is end user remote and on site support and we not told of any ISO standardization going on until he sent me this unpleasant email. So it would of been logic for him to propose something in that order, instead of proclaiming my ignorance CCs included ? Cool, you got me on the right track.

Thanks again !

Meldy

 

[JaneB]

The thing is our level is end user remote and on site support and we not told of any ISO standardization going on until he sent me this unpleasant email. So it would of been logic for him to propose something in that order, instead of proclaiming my ignorance CCs included

Yes, it would. Although (I'm not apologising for the method, which was not good) is it possible that the procedure does exist and you didn't know about it and/or were advising something that contradicted it?

The key thing he is trying to avoid is not having 'just anyone' changing a document when they feel like it and re-releasing it. That isn't document 'control' - it's document 'mayhem' and not good practice.

If you didn't know, your manager didn't advise you, the quality ISO person/team didn't communicate it, the problem is at their end. But if it was communicated and you didn't know it/follow it, it's at your end. Either way, best find out.