Generating ISO 9001 interest in management.

Sidney Vianna

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Right on, Mike. Some of us have had a chance to work for and work with many organizations. As a management system auditor, I had the opportunity to interact with (literally) hundreds of companies. Lack of cultural compatibility by top management with modern quality approach is, without a question, one of the top three failure modes in attaining (not certification) a sustainable, cost effective and business friendly Quality (big Q) system.

The “solution” of assigning a lone wolf, way down on the totem pole underling to do the heavy burden of “take us to certified” status is as stupid as they come. Pathetically stupid.
 

Golfman25

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Many times we/they (upper management) often deserve all the complaints we/they get.

The OP said upper management has little to no interest in getting involved in the process. Maybe they don't agree with the approach as you said, but is it leadership to let someone flounder who is on the wrong path or not qualified to lead the effort?
sure, but it would be nice to get Management's side of the story. I am sure they think differently. The whole idea that permeates these threads is management is some dullard who doesn't care. I'll bet they do care, but they also have more than just the "quality department" to answer to.
 

Sidney Vianna

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The whole idea that permeates these threads is management is some dullard who doesn't care.
The words from the OP:
My problem at the moment is upper management has little to no interest in getting involved in the process, and from what I've read the majority of the culture push and performance changes begin from upper management. I have been generating forms and procedures as I go, and when I try to bring production or engineering managers into the process, I get a lot of eye-rolls, crossing arms and sighs.

I feel like I'm going crazy. I have a monumental objective to complete but those with the power to help and push the project forward give little to no effort to cooperate and align our goals.
So, you are deliberately belittling the OP’s perspective because you want to be a contrarian, negating what everybody who knows anything about quality including a guy by the name of Deming stated the overwhelming majority of quality problems is due to mismanagement.
 

Golfman25

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The words from the OP:

So, you are deliberately belittling the OP’s perspective because you want to be a contrarian, negating what everybody who knows anything about quality including a guy by the name of Deming stated the overwhelming majority of quality problems is due to mismanagement.
No. Management is just a cop out. It's easy to say it -- "management doesn't care." Maybe they don't, but my advice is don't get caught into using the same excuse.

We don't know what "little to no interest in getting involved in the process" even means.
 

Sidney Vianna

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We don't know what "little to no interest in getting involved in the process" even means.
For me, as someone who has English as a second language, it is crystal clear.

I would love to see you debate Deming on American management effectiveness towards quality. Maybe with AI generated content, one day, we will.
 

Randy

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it is crystal clear.
Here's some crystal for ya.
Generating ISO 9001 interest in management.
 

Mike S.

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No. Management is just a cop out. It's easy to say it -- "management doesn't care." Maybe they don't, but my advice is don't get caught into using the same excuse.

We don't know what "little to no interest in getting involved in the process" even means.
If we assume every poster who presents a problem here is wrong or not telling the truth, we have nowhere to go on this forum.

None of us has the direct experience the OP does with this particular issue in his company, but based on my gut from what I am reading and what I have experienced many, many times in my decades in this business, I have seen this often enough to believe it.

Heck, I have held titles well beyond quality technician (which is what I started as after college) and often suffered with lack of management support, which sometimes happens even now. If you don't, that's fantastic. Or, maybe I just look for a cop out. ;)
 

Golfman25

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If we assume every poster who presents a problem here is wrong or not telling the truth, we have nowhere to go on this forum.

None of us has the direct experience the OP does with this particular issue in his company, but based on my gut from what I am reading and what I have experienced many, many times in my decades in this business, I have seen this often enough to believe it.

Heck, I have held titles well beyond quality technician (which is what I started as after college) and often suffered with lack of management support, which sometimes happens even now. If you don't, that's fantastic. Or, maybe I just look for a cop out. ;)
I have been there. It's fun to rag on "management." But you know what, as we get older and move up in the world, we find maybe we where just venting and not aware of all the other issues involved. That's all.
 

qualitymanagerTT

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At the end of last year, my company decided that ISO and IATF are necessary for us to acquire new customers in our exhaust business. I am a quality technician and was brought up into the project after my manager(who is no longer with the company thank goodness) decided he wasn't interested in pushing this project forward.
The last Quality Manager may have had valid reasons for leaving.

There have been many examples of individual experiences in this thread, and some of them may be applicable to your situation.

If you still want to try to move this forward, you can present upper management with the official implementation approach (available for free) from the committee which wrote ISO 9001:

If they aren't interested in moving past step #1 on page 8, then I'd agree with the posters who said you should consider doing something else (at your company, or not).

And as one poster said, starting with documentation is not correct (it's step #4 based on what the committee wrote) - that's like putting on your shoes then putting on your socks.
 
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