Have you Ever Wished You Could Audit Your CB

C

ChrissieO

#1
Without even getting off my chair and visiting our CB, I could raise a number of NCs against them this week.

How many can you spot?

Scenario:-

Take into consideration in our division of our company we probably have approxiamately 12 auditing days a year across TS/9001/18001/14001. Across the UK we probably book approximately 120 days a year, globally I cant even begin to think how much business we put their way.

We had a strategic review scheduled for tommorow which has been scheduled since January. We get an email from someone we have never heard of 2 days before the visit, saying that he will be arriving to do our strategic review and he was our new client manager.

We request that this person contacts us. No call. At 10am we call our previous CM who explains that he is on secondment since May and our administrative account manager should of let us know at the time and was sorry he hadn't let us know and said he would get the new CM to call us today, by 3pm still no call ........

We had an audit at one of our our sites 2 weeks ago by a local CB auditor, nothing was said then.

We have complained about the CBs lack of communication in the past and were assured they would always keep us informed of any changes that could have an impact on our relationship with the CB and that it was part of their customer procedures to do so.

If they can't conform to the standards never mind their own SOPs how the hell can they be fit to audit us!!!!:mg:

Chrissie
 
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Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#2
Because your CB is accredited, they must be in (theorethical) conformance with ISO 17021, which requires them to have a QMS. One of the options for QMS is ISO 9001. So, they obviously need to react to customer dissatisfaction. It is up to you to trigger a formal and firm complaint, demanding corrective action and keep them accountable to effective root cause analysis and effective corrective action.
Certainly you could audit them as any customer should be able to audit a supplier, but what is the point of an audit if you already plenty of evidence that their customer relationship process is seriously lacking? Go, instead, straight to a corrective action request.
 
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Q

qualityboi

#3
Actually any company with a ISO9001 cert should have the right to do it if their supplier management program and contractual agreements advocate it. We gave a SCAR to our CB and then eventually changed CBs for 14001/18001.:)
 

Randy

Super Moderator
#4
Let's see.......

1. Chrissie is in the UK

2. Chrissie's org does TS/9/14/18

3. The auditor's job title is Client Manager

4. They book globally

5. Oh krap!:mg: (As Sgt Shultz used to say in Hogan's Heros "I know nothinggggggg":nope:
 
C

ChrissieO

#5
Actually any company with a ISO9001 cert should have the right to do it if their supplier management program and contractual agreements advocate it. We gave a SCAR to our CB and then eventually changed CBs for 14001/18001.:)
The comment about actually auditing them was a little tongue in cheek as I am totally aware that I could 2nd party them. We are AGAIN going through their formal complaints procedure.

C
 
C

ChrissieO

#6
Let's see.......

1. Chrissie is in the UK

2. Chrissie's org does TS/9/14/18

3. The auditor's job title is Client Manager

4. They book globally

5. Oh krap!:mg: (As Sgt Shultz used to say in Hogan's Heros "I know nothinggggggg":nope:
Oh and some of our other divisions do 13485, 17025 and currently one division is working toward AS9100

:lol:;)

Chrissie
 
C

ChrissieO

#7
follow up....................

Yesterday afternoon we emailed the new CM to say that we were cancelling today's SR, he would of been due to arrive at 9am this morning and we have not had any communication from him acknowledging the cancellation or to reschedule and had he truned up we would quite happily thrown our professional teddies out of the pram and turned him away.

Chrissie
 
C

ChrissieO

#8
Without even getting off my chair and visiting our CB, I could raise a number of NCs against them this week.

How many can you spot?

Chrissie
So far I have identified NCs against 14 clauses and sub clauses in 9001 & TS, I am sure I could find more if I wanted to but that will give them enough to get on with :cool:

Chrissie
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#9
So far I have identified NCs against 14 clauses and sub clauses in 9001 & TS
In fairness, your CB should not be expected to comply with TS 16949. As I stated earlier, your CB must abide by ISO 17021, which calls for the CB to have a QMS in place.

But just because your CB audits and certifies you to a myriad of standards, it does not mean that they should be held to those same standards. :tg:
 
C

ChrissieO

#10
In fairness, your CB should not be expected to comply with TS 16949. As I stated earlier, your CB must abide by ISO 17021, which calls for the CB to have a QMS in place.

But just because your CB audits and certifies you to a myriad of standards, it does not mean that they should be held to those same standards. :tg:
Sidney, lighten up - it is a bit tongue in cheek

The ones I have identified are all pretty basic requirements for any quality management system and I would expect to see evidence of them in any 2nd Party supplier audit even if with our suppliers who are not 9001 or TS. 10 of the ones I have identified are basic requirements of 9001 and fall into the "SHALL" criteria.

To me if they are required to have a QMS system by ISO17021 they should be able to demonstrate that this is effective.

Chrissie
 
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