How many mandays should the ISO9001 registration audit be?

[Ingeniero1]

Initially, we were scheduled for a four-day audit, and this is what was quoted by the registrar. Somewhere along the way we started 'talking' three days, and the only reference that I can find to three days is an e-mail from the assigned auditor in which he specifies a Wednesday-through-Friday time frame, 18 through 20 August. Based on this, which was back in May, I scheduled the audit for those three days, but now find this my be incorrect.

I understand that the length of an audit (ISO 9001:2000) is based on the number of employees. We presently have 85 employees, but this can fluctuate by 10 either way. How many days 'should' the audit be?

Thanks -

Alex

 

[Rachel]

Hi Alex,

We had a similar situation. When we originally started the certification process, we had about 110 employees (approx 70 on day shift) - by the time we got to the actual audit, we had 77 employees (approx 65 on day shift). We were set up for four audit days (2 auditors, 2 days).

Keep in mind that for ISO 9001, number of audit days is based on number of *day shift* employees - not total number. QS9000 used to (and I think TS16949 does) require audits of all shifts - ISO 9001 just requires a day shift audit.

Hope this helps - some of the consultants/third-party auditors in this forum should be able to give you a better idea.
Cheers,
-R.

 

[Randy]

You will find the manday chart in IAF Guide 62 to ISO Guidance 62. The days are established by the accreditation guidlines for accredited registrars.

 

[Ingeniero1]

OK, we have only one shift (days) and all 85 employees work then.
Also, the audit will be conducted by one auditor.

I did a Google search for the suggested "IAF Guide 62 to ISO Guidance 62" and found several links, mostly foreign countries, and all were in the form of questionnaires, and I didn’t see any ‘number-of-employees / audit-man-days’ references, but I may have missed it.

The length of the audit (as in this case, for ISO 9001:2000) does not vary among registrars, true? So if it is four man-days for registrar-A, it would also be four man-days for registrar-B, true?

If we settle at 85 employees, one shift, what would the audit length be?

Thanks again!

Alex

 

[Al Rosen]

OK, we have only one shift (days) and all 85 employees work then.
Also, the audit will be conducted by one auditor.

I did a Google search for the suggested "IAF Guide 62 to ISO Guidance 62" and found several links, mostly foreign countries, and all were in the form of questionnaires, and I didn’t see any ‘number-of-employees / audit-man-days’ references, but I may have missed it.

The length of the audit (as in this case, for ISO 9001:2000) does not vary among registrars, true? So if it is four man-days for registrar-A, it would also be four man-days for registrar-B, true?

If we settle at 85 employees, one shift, what would the audit length be?

Thanks again!

Alex

Alex:

See annex 2 of the attached IAF Guidance.

 

[Ingeniero1]

Got it!

<< Al - >>

Alex

 

[Sidney Vianna]

The IAF Guidance is the starting point. You can deviate, for more, or less, depending on the specifics of your system, eg, exclusions, complexity of the process, repetitiveness of processess, criticality of the product/service, etc . . .

Ing, if I were you, I would not leave this to chance. Obviously you must have a contractual agreement with your Registrar. That agreement either lists or refers to a quote with the number of auditor days -ad's- to be deployed, during your audit. So, if the original quote was for 4 ad's and now, the auditor states that he will spend only 3 days, call the Registrar and ask for clarification, such as:

Are 3 ad's adequate? Am I going to be charged for 4 ad's?

You run the risk of having an audit done with inadequate ad's and your eventual certification might be at risk.

What if the auditor is cramming two audits in that week and have already reserved Monday and Tuesday somewhere else, so, he only has Wed-Fri to audit you. He might not be paying attention to required number of ad's.

So, if I were you, I would call someone at a management level at the Registrar and ask this same question.

Just fyi. For an organization with 85 employees (without knowing the details, as mentioned above), the certification audit should be more along 5 to 5.5 ad's. Seems to me that 3 ad's is way too short.