How to use a PAS (Preventive Action Suggestion)

C

cc4583

#1
Hello Everyone,

This is a pretty basic question but I was hoping that I could get some advice. I am the quality manager and our company recently became certified so we are still in the learning phase of ISO. I was auditing our Preventive Action procedure and came across a Preventive Action that was opened by an employee because they wanted to make an improvement to our HR manual (which is a controlled document) and add some information about flex time and bereavement.

My first instinct was that this should not have been opened as a Preventive Action but rather a document change form since the document that was being reviewed and updated was a controlled document. (Relating to our control of documents procedure)

I explained this to the employee but they were literally arguing with me with reasons this should be a Preventive Action. So I started questioning myself.

A Preventive Action is used to eliminate potential non-conformances. And there was nonconformance here correct? The fact that we do not have a bereavement policy in place is not a nonconformance. We just needed to make some policy updates and update our HR manual.

Am I correct?

Thank you for your help. I just find that many employees are using the Preventive Actions as a "suggestion box".
 
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Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#2
Re: How to use a PAS

I don't know what "PAS" means, exactly (except that "PA" seems to be Preventive Action), but it seems that perhaps your categories aren't clearly defined. Then again, I don't know what a "PAS" is, so why not explain that, and your requirements for its use?
 
C

cc4583

#3
Re: How to use a PAS

I apologize. I am talking about a preventive action. The consultant we used called it a PAS "Preventive Action Suggestion".
 
C

cc4583

#5
Re: How to use a PAS

Maybe we need to be more specific. Now that I am reading over our procedure it does seem a bit vague. We simply state that a preventive action is opened to take action to eliminate the causes of potential nonconformities in order to prevent their occurrence. I just don't see how not having information written up about flex time and bereavement is a nonconformance. That is where I am struggling with why a preventive action should have been issued for this particular issue.

Do we need to clearly define what a nonconformance is?
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#6
Re: How to use a PAS

Maybe we need to be more specific. Now that I am reading over our procedure it does seem a bit vague. We simply state that a preventive action is opened to take action to eliminate the causes of potential nonconformities in order to prevent their occurrence. I just don't see how not having information written up about flex time and bereavement is a nonconformance. That is where I am struggling with why a preventive action should have been issued for this particular issue.

Do we need to clearly define what a nonconformance is?
That's one way to approach it, but you don't want to discourage people from trying to improve things by telling them they've filled out the wrong form and then arguing about it. It's the message that's important in most cases, not the medium. Don't get yourself so ISOfied that you lose sight of the goal.

In like manner, it's not a good idea to have process documentation that's so prescriptive that making a suggestion for improvement using the wrong form turns a positive effort into a nonconformity.
 
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