How would you audit this process?

S

supacook2k

Hi All,

A friend of mine works for a company that has a quality management system which is compliant with ISO9001. Through my university course i have read about auditing etc so i asked my friend to provide me with a process document that is used in his company as the company i work for doesn't have any documents like this. It refers to a procedure and also a work instruction so not sure which it is.

It seems like a straight forward activity that gets carried out so How would you audit this process, what things would you be checking if doing an internal audit relating to ISO 9001 or the management of quality around the activity?

Auditing seems quite interesting to me so i was wondering how people go about it in practice.
 

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A

AndyN

Moved On
Wow! Someone knew how to make life tough for the person doing the job, didn't they? Well, start by highlighting the keywords. There are really only a few keywords which all the others "join up" to make grammatical sense.

Highlight job positions, what that person does etc, the use of the lists, forms etc. too.

Then have someone actually show you what happens and you should be able to follow along - but be prepared for small deviations - which you have to decide if they are significant, by talking with the person who does the job! Better still have THEM show you how they comply with this document! pointing out as they go along! Simples!
 
John Broomfield

John Broomfield

Leader
Super Moderator
supacook2k,

It is not even a process.

In the documented procedure you provided, I could find no process objective and it seems not to describe what actually happens. What is input to the process and by whom? What is the output of the process and to whom?

And why so much time wasted on appraisal when process management is about preventing nonconformity while working to add value?

We cannot advise of how to audit until you provide the audit objective.

John
 
Randy

Randy

Super Moderator
John Broomfield said:
supacook2k,

It is not even a process.

In the documented procedure you provided, I could find no process objective and it seems not to describe what actually happens. What is input to the process and by whom? What is the output of the process and to whom?

And why so much time wasted on appraisal when process management is about preventing nonconformity while working to add value?

We cannot advise of how to audit until you provide the audit objective.

John
Click to expand...


You're wrong! There is a clear objective in line 1.1 "to comply with Company Policy <XX-XX-XX> ‘Company Documentation" for reasons detailed in 1.3

You can see required inputs such as in 1.4, necessary actions to be performed such as in 1.5, actions to be taken such as in 1.6, references to follow and apparent examples of what or how, and the output could be verified upon effective performance of this document

Whether it's called a procedure, instruction or the Humpty-Dumpty plan doesn't matter and a competent auditor could audit performance and conformance

A process is nothing more than required or necessary inputs transformed into desired or required outputs....Making a picture of Kool-Aide is a process as is making a cup of tea for criminy sake
 
Randy

Randy

Super Moderator
Randy said:
You're wrong! There is a clear objective in line 1.1 "to comply with Company Policy <XX-XX-XX> ?Company Documentation" for reasons detailed in 1.3

You can see required inputs such as in 1.4, necessary actions to be performed such as in 1.5, actions to be taken such as in 1.6, references to follow and apparent examples of what or how, and the output could be verified upon effective performance of this document

Whether it's called a procedure, instruction or the Humpty-Dumpty plan doesn't matter and a competent auditor could audit performance and conformance
Click to expand...

A process is nothing more than required or necessary inputs transformed into desired or required outputs....Making a picture of Kool-Aide is a process as is making a cup of tea for criminy sake
 
John Broomfield

John Broomfield

Leader
Super Moderator
Randy,

"This procedure is written to comply with Company Policy" is the reason stated for writing the procedure.

It is not a reason for doing the work (aka process) described by the procedure.

This is a common fault with many documented procedures. They fail to provide criteria for monitoring the effectiveness of the process per 4.1c and 8.2.3.

And as we know, monitoring should happen before audit.

John
 
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