IATF 16949 Calibration Laboratory Scope

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hngrad1977

Starting to get Involved
#3
I have a question on lab scopes. We have all of our calibrations performed by an outside service who is ISO 17025 certified. We do no in house. The auditor is writing a finding because the calibration company scope does not specifically say "height gage". We called the gage house and they told us one dimensional measurement devices are captured in a generic phrase. I pulled up some other scopes of gage labs and as example, calipers and micrometers both have the ability to measure outside diameter so the scope says "Outside Diameter", not micrometer. I tried to show the auditor multiple scopes from 17025 certified gage houses where scopes were like that. I plan on appealing but does anyone have advice on how to handle this?
 

Golfman25

Trusted Information Resource
#4
I have a question on lab scopes. We have all of our calibrations performed by an outside service who is ISO 17025 certified. We do no in house. The auditor is writing a finding because the calibration company scope does not specifically say "height gage". We called the gage house and they told us one dimensional measurement devices are captured in a generic phrase. I pulled up some other scopes of gage labs and as example, calipers and micrometers both have the ability to measure outside diameter so the scope says "Outside Diameter", not micrometer. I tried to show the auditor multiple scopes from 17025 certified gage houses where scopes were like that. I plan on appealing but does anyone have advice on how to handle this?
Yes it does. It's probably worded different. See if you can find something close. Drop gage, depth gage, drop indicator, etc. I can't imagine a ISO 17025 accredited lab that couldn't handle a simple "height gage."

We had used a simple "all commonly found hand gages such as micrometers, calipers, etc." which worked for a while, but started getting push back because we didn't include a torque gage.
 
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#5
I have a question on lab scopes. We have all of our calibrations performed by an outside service who is ISO 17025 certified. We do no in house. The auditor is writing a finding because the calibration company scope does not specifically say "height gage". We called the gage house and they told us one dimensional measurement devices are captured in a generic phrase. I pulled up some other scopes of gage labs and as example, calipers and micrometers both have the ability to measure outside diameter so the scope says "Outside Diameter", not micrometer. I tried to show the auditor multiple scopes from 17025 certified gage houses where scopes were like that. I plan on appealing but does anyone have advice on how to handle this?
That's complete rubbish and the auditor should be shown the door! My advice is to do some research of accredited lab scopes and include them in your rebuttal or this incompetent auditor (and you should make abundantly clear you recognize this deficiency) and tell them NOT to send this auditor - or any other who has similar incompetency to do your next audit.
 

hngrad1977

Starting to get Involved
#6
I showed the auditor other gage lab scopes which only stated "Outside Diameter" and "Inside Diameter" and not the specific gage and he is insistent. Told me to have my gage calibration service change their scope, which isn't happening. Second option was to change vendor (not cost effective). I gave a third version, to appeal and send other gage lab scopes which are worded as above, ANAB approved, and known across the country. I have also sent an email to ANAB asking them to clarify what is acceptable and what was going on. Waiting on a response. Also sent an email to the IAOB to get their opinion. As I told the auditor, my time is to valuable waste on a non-issue. Amazing how some auditors get their dander up when you inform them you are going to appeal and actually show them the evidence you are going to present. What else can I do?
 
#7
I showed the auditor other gage lab scopes which only stated "Outside Diameter" and "Inside Diameter" and not the specific gage and he is insistent. Told me to have my gage calibration service change their scope, which isn't happening. Second option was to change vendor (not cost effective). I gave a third version, to appeal and send other gage lab scopes which are worded as above, ANAB approved, and known across the country. I have also sent an email to ANAB asking them to clarify what is acceptable and what was going on. Waiting on a response. Also sent an email to the IAOB to get their opinion. As I told the auditor, my time is to valuable waste on a non-issue. Amazing how some auditors get their dander up when you inform them you are going to appeal and actually show them the evidence you are going to present. What else can I do?
You have done the correct thing.

What really worries those of us who understand: How many other hapless clients has this auditor written up for the same useless nonsense? Those who don't know the Cove exists? Don't want to create waves with their auditor or CB? Don't KNOW any better than to roll over?
 

hngrad1977

Starting to get Involved
#8
Below are listings of one of the largest gage calibration facilities in the country, and notice nowhere does it call for a specific type of gage:


Calibration Parameter / Equipment

Outside Diameter
Inside Diameter
Length
Depth / Height

I have tried to reason with the auditor but there comes the time when one just has take a deep breath and let it go. I can sleep at night as everyone knows what my intentions and actions are, and I don't plan to change auditors since this is my initial registration for IATF 16949. I will work with this man for the next three years. It may be a hate / hate relationship but that is ok. Quality people can deal with anything. And who says auditors get no respect.... :)
 
#10
Below are listings of one of the largest gage calibration facilities in the country, and notice nowhere does it call for a specific type of gage:


Calibration Parameter / Equipment

Outside Diameter
Inside Diameter
Length
Depth / Height

I have tried to reason with the auditor but there comes the time when one just has take a deep breath and let it go. I can sleep at night as everyone knows what my intentions and actions are, and I don't plan to change auditors since this is my initial registration for IATF 16949. I will work with this man for the next three years. It may be a hate / hate relationship but that is ok. Quality people can deal with anything. And who says auditors get no respect.... :)
It would be good if they'd do something to earn it...
 
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