If ANSI can self-declare, why not you?

[Randy]

Probably...

The big question I have is ...Why now? ISO 9001 didn't just happen overnight, so why are they now trying to get on the wagon?

BTW...Glad to see you still here..Jim

 

[Jim Wynne]

Probably...

The big question I have is ...Why now? ISO 9001 didn't just happen overnight, so why are they now trying to get on the wagon?

BTW...Glad to see you still here..Jim

Thanks, Randy. I think it's probably because they got to a point where things were out of hand and there was some suit there who was willing to admit it and try to change.

 

[Wes Bucey]

I suppose the only thing that would perk their ears would be a reduction in prices by eliminating the expense of registration (i.e. third party audits).

The problem here is (and maybe I'm only talking from my own experience) that $1200 x 3 facilities annually, plus the 3 day's time involved for personnel, does not really amount to much of a reduction in total annual sales. And that annual registration cost is really the only difference! A smart company will always have a good QMS and controls to keep it that way, regardless of the wallpaper, or not.

It seems to me the major cost of registration is the soft cost of the panicked running around many organizations do getting ready for a 3rd party audit rather than the hard cost of dollars paid to the registrar for his auditors.

Small companies (using Guide 62 auditor days guidelines) really can get a bargain rate for registration. Many small companies, however, are in such a panic over the impending audit, they run out and hire very expensive consultants to ensure they make it through the audit the first time.

I, like many of you, have sometimes profited from being the expert from afar. The only thing that saved me from total paralysis at the guilt of charging money is that I ALWAYS told them in advance, "I can't do anything for you that you couldn't do on your own, except save you from going up a few blind alleys. The time savings in avoiding those blind alleys is what you are really paying for."

 

[Wes Bucey]

Probably...

The big question I have is ...Why now? ISO 9001 didn't just happen overnight, so why are they now trying to get on the wagon?

BTW...Glad to see you still here..Jim

Don't any of you find it curious that ANSI is one of the American copyright holders of 9001:2000?

Here's a copy of the pertinent paragraph from MY COPY:
©2000 by ASQ
Copyright Protection Notice for the ANSI/ISO/ASQ Q9001-2000 Standard.
This standard is subject to copyright claims of ISO, ANSI, and ASQ. Not for resale. No part of this publication may be reproduced in any form, including an electronic retrieval system, without the prior written permission of ASQ. All requests pertaining to the ANSI/ISO/ASQ Q9001-2000 Standard should be submitted to ASQ.

 

[Randy]

OH, no....ANSI's relationship to the ISO goes back to 1946-47 when the ISO was started and the organizations relationship to 9001 is no secret at all...they belong to TC176 (and TC207 for the 14K folks), in fact ANSI is who sets the rules for who can or cannot play in their ISO ballgame on the American portion of the TC's.

This is one of the cases I just have to stand up and scream "BULL S*IT".....unless they can prove it.

Their claim has no more validity than my claim would that DSEQ, Inc. adheres to ISO 9001:2000 & 14001:2004 (DSEQ,Inc. is my corporation that I did personal business under and is still a legal corporation)...BTW we don't, but I could make the claim as well.

 

[Laura M]

Not a state thing

I don't know about your state, but here in NY companies can self certify themselves to ISO. I am frequently asked by the local group of companies in my area to join their self certification program. They basically audit each other. The problem is that having seen their quality systems up close and personal, there are too many gaps and out of control processes.

NY state, nor any other state has jurisdiction over whether or not companies 'self certify.' I'm curious which 'local group' is promoting - not that anything is 'necessarily wrong' but as long as it's not promoting that they are certified.

 

[Carl Keller]

ANSI does not have to register. Where else are you going to go?

They probably have a better knowledge than the average company whether 9001 registration is on the way out (Please refer to the "How many companies are really registered to ISO 9001" thread)

The joke is on us.

Carl-

 

[Icy Mountain]

What about Supplier Development?

I must buy ANSI/ISO/ASQ standards like TS16949 in order to keep my QMS registered.
Therefore, ANSI and ASQ are suppliers under my QMS.
TS requires that these suppliers must be THIRD PARTY registered to ISO9001 unless waived by my customer.
So, I am hereby removing ANSI and ASQ from my approved supplier list and I'm not buying any more standards that they copyrighted until they can prove 3rd part registration.

Who's with me?

 

[Wes Bucey]

I must buy ANSI/ISO/ASQ standards like TS16949 in order to keep my QMS registered.
Therefore, ANSI and ASQ are suppliers under my QMS.
TS requires that these suppliers must be THIRD PARTY registered to ISO9001 unless waived by my customer.
So, I am hereby removing ANSI and ASQ from my approved supplier list and I'm not buying any more standards that they copyrighted until they can prove 3rd part registration.

Who's with me?

At the very least, I would hope you'd point out the quandary to your customer and allow him to issue a formal waiver.

Alternately, perhaps your customer would recognize the idiocy of requiring all supply chain members to register to an international Standard and issue a blanket waiver that each link in the supply chain shall have the authority to issue waivers for each lower link!

 

[Randy]

I must buy ANSI/ISO/ASQ standards like TS16949 in order to keep my QMS registered.
Therefore, ANSI and ASQ are suppliers under my QMS.
TS requires that these suppliers must be THIRD PARTY registered to ISO9001 unless waived by my customer.
So, I am hereby removing ANSI and ASQ from my approved supplier list and I'm not buying any more standards that they copyrighted until they can prove 3rd part registration.

Who's with me?

You know this could snowball and frost their fanny's in addition to stopping some of the egg sucking.

Good luck....

BTW..Are you saying that you have identified a N/C situation that needs C/A?