Imaged signature is it Ok?

Silex7

Involved In Discussions
#1
Hello Dear fellows,

I am organizing my internal & external claims reports . my routine of handling the claims documentation is to have a soft copy of the final report sent to customer on my drive (and I usually use picture of my own signature and company stamp I use cropped from the original photo and send it electronically to customer to preserve image Quality and to save some time )..and I keep another ''paper''-printed reports in my file archive at the office.
So my question is, sometimes my Top manager is travelling abroad ( for business trip), well is it Ok to print out the soft copy of the report (that have the cropped images of the stamp and the signature)? , would that mis-constitute with the ISO policies?

Any help is appreciated
 
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Ninja

Looking for Reality
Trusted Information Resource
#2
..... well is it Ok to print out the soft copy of the report (that have the cropped images of the stamp and the signature)? , would that mis-constitute with the ISO policies?
Policies written by ISO...no conflict. ISO does not regulate signatures, electronic or otherwise.

But does it go against policies put in place by your own company? Or other regulatory body?
That depends on the requirements your company has put on itself.
That is something you'll have to check out within your own procedures and any applicable regulatory bodies. Your company may have set its own rules regarding this type of thing...

The only way this would be a non-conformance to ISO is if your company mandates one procedure, and you are not following it. We can't help you determine that since the procedure (if any) is internal to your company.
 

Eredhel

Quality Manager
#3
I use digital signatures when I fill out CoCs even when it's my own signature. I've never had an issue from a customer or auditor. But like Ninja pointed out, be sure you don't have something else that might require something different.
 

Silex7

Involved In Discussions
#4
Policies written by ISO...no conflict. ISO does not regulate signatures, electronic or otherwise.

But does it go against policies put in place by your own company? Or other regulatory body?
That depends on the requirements your company has put on itself.
That is something you'll have to check out within your own procedures and any applicable regulatory bodies. Your company may have set its own rules regarding this type of thing...

The only way this would be a non-conformance to ISO is if your company mandates one procedure, and you are not following it. We can't help you determine that since the procedure (if any) is internal to your company.

Thank you for your response.
My company's regulation doesn't restrict anything about this issue, means it's ok if I file claims reports that's way, but some institutions regulations do not always comply or correspond with the ISO regulations ( not to mention they intend to so, but just to say they don't know).
What i wanted to say is that in my position I have this participation of constituting my company's quality regulations, but to mention the ISO standards, I had these inquiries that driven me to ask whether it's Ok or not.
 

Silex7

Involved In Discussions
#5
I use digital signatures when I fill out CoCs even when it's my own signature. I've never had an issue from a customer or auditor. But like Ninja pointed out, be sure you don't have something else that might require something different.
Thank you for your response. I just had some issue with documents correction methodologies..etc. in auditing visits, that's why I asked that question. I just want to make sure is done accurately and correctly in the same time specially when it comes to stamp and signatures.
 

BradM

Staff member
Admin
#6
Hello Dear fellows,

I am organizing my internal & external claims reports . my routine of handling the claims documentation is to have a soft copy of the final report sent to customer on my drive (and I usually use picture of my own signature and company stamp I use cropped from the original photo and send it electronically to customer to preserve image Quality and to save some time )..and I keep another ''paper''-printed reports in my file archive at the office.
So my question is, sometimes my Top manager is travelling abroad ( for business trip), well is it Ok to print out the soft copy of the report (that have the cropped images of the stamp and the signature)? , would that mis-constitute with the ISO policies?

Any help is appreciated
Hello Silex7!

OK... I may be the only human that responds in this manner, so you can ignore anything I say! :tg:

I would say that it's NOT ok to use an imaged signature. Because... it's not a signature. It's not unique nor controlled; anyone can use that image and put on anything. When your customer gets the documents, what is to keep one of them from heisting that imaged signature and putting it on anything they want?

I would back up and ask... why do you have a signature? What does it mean? What does it imply? I know... kind of Dobie Gillis sounding philosophy questions. If the signature is just a commercial/feel good type thing, I would remove them. Just have your name typed.

If the signature is to indicate some level of review/approval, then I think you should consider beefing up your signature system. I would get an e-signature system and integrate with Adobe. Or, sign wet signatures and scan or something.
 

Ninja

Looking for Reality
Trusted Information Resource
#7
<snip> ... Because... it's not a signature. It's not unique nor controlled; anyone can use that image and put on anything.
...<snip>
Agree with most, perhaps all, of what Brad said.

Just pointing out that "It's not unique nor controlled" is an assumption...it depends on how it is handled. In most cases I've seen, Brad is 100% correct.

...but there are ways of controlling the digital sig...
short of photoshop or Gimp at which point nothing that shows up on a computer is controlled...
screen grab and photoshop can falsify most everything you see in day to day life.

If you'r just slapping on an image with no other outside controls...I can't see what value the image has.
 

BradM

Staff member
Admin
#8
Agree with most, perhaps all, of what Brad said.

Just pointing out that "It's not unique nor controlled" is an assumption...it depends on how it is handled. In most cases I've seen, Brad is 100% correct.

...but there are ways of controlling the digital sig...
short of photoshop or Gimp at which point nothing that shows up on a computer is controlled...
screen grab and photoshop can falsify most everything you see in day to day life.

If you'r just slapping on an image with no other outside controls...I can't see what value the image has.

Yes! Thank you! I got a head of myself and I totally agree.

As long as you have a process and whatever signature system is in control, it may work.

Note: that is not the case if you were working with the FDA; but I assume you're not.
 

Eredhel

Quality Manager
#9
I'm not opposed to the points made against using digital signatures, the concerns are great. I will add that you can have unique digital signatures and controls for who has access to using them and where. We do this.

But also there are government approved forms that allow for simple typed initials and typed names that are not unique but are allowed to be used for digital signatures by just typing from a keyboard. Now I prefer doing it our way where there is some control, some uniqueness, and it's not just any one grabbing a keyboard and typing. But really this comes down to how the organization wants to control it and ISO 9001 doesn't get that specific, the org can choose the how.

Again I don't disagree with the concerns, but I still feel it's doable and that ISO doesn't dig that deep if you have controls.
 

Silex7

Involved In Discussions
#10
Thank you guys for sharing me this, appreciated!


Well , yes you are totally right this is something that should be controlled though. but do you mean I should construct and initiate a controlling internal document in my organization for this? , something like ''authorized issued documents'' for example?
 
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