Internal Audit Nonconformances must be Closed prior to Registration?

G

Gayle215

#21
Nonconformance closure before certification

We're a corporate office that supports several different locations. We have an open issue that spans across several months as the corrective action is implemented into each location. It was closed for the location applying for certification but, is still an open issue for our other plants.
We received TS certiifcation in June 2004
 
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Anerol C

Trusted Information Resource
#22
Re: Internal audit non conformances

What about for ISO 9001:2000; What are the rules?
We are still working to fix the non conformancies found during the internal audit. Our new Quality Manager told us today during a meeting that we can not have certification audit until all the nonconformancies are closed, by the other hand the Corporate ISO 9000 Coordinator told us in the past that as far as we have a plan this will be fine to have the certification audit.
I'm also confused about when is the appropiate time to have stage 1 audit, last week I got the documentation review result some items need to be addressed on the documents but as I commented we are still working to fix internal audit findings. What is your recommendation? If we have not fixed the issues, Will we fail stage one audit? :confused:

Thanks for your input..... I appreciate it.:thanx:
AC

P.S I don't know what to do, we are not automotive and new QC manager is coming from an automotive enviroment, he also is planning to implement PPAP's, PFMEA's those are things that I was trying to implement when I started with the certification process but I was prevented to do it as this is not an ISO 9000 requirement and the company didn't have the resources to do it.:nopity:
 

SteelMaiden

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#23
There is no requirement in ISO 9001-2000 stating that all internal corrective actions must be closed prior to certification...if there is a requirement from a registrar for that, I don't know. But, imho, it would be pretty stupid. Basically someone is saying "clean everything up, but don't identify anything else because we don't want to be working on anything when the registrar comes in."
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#24
I agree with Steel. But remember, accredited CB's have to satisfy the requirements of overarching documents, such as ISO Guide 62 and/or ISO 17021, the IAF Mandatory and Guidance documents that are enforced as requirements, plus the AB's procedures, Rules, etc...

In those documents there are requirements which affect the registrants. However, to the best of my knowledge, there are no requirements that mandate internal audit originated CAR's to be closed, prior to certification. On the other hand, you need to be able to demonstrate that your corrective action process is working and effective.
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#25
I agree with Steel. But remember, accredited CB's have to satisfy the requirements of overarching documents, such as ISO Guide 62 and/or ISO 17021, the IAF Mandatory and Guidance documents that are enforced as requirements, plus the AB's procedures, Rules, etc...

In those documents there are requirements which affect the registrants. However, to the best of my knowledge, there are no requirements that mandate internal audit originated CAR's to be closed, prior to certification. On the other hand, you need to be able to demonstrate that your corrective action process is working and effective.
I agree with Sidney. It would not be possible (under normal circumstances) to close out a corrective action that was initiated 2 days prior to the registration audit. Most important criterion: as long as there are no signs of corrective action neglect/delays. In other words "undue delay" gets you in trouble.

Stijloor.
 
A

aeroqual

#26
Does your procedure for nonconforming material specify a timeframe for closing nonconformances? That would be one method to assure their is no issue with the auditor. Otherwise, as long as you can show objective evidence that the nonconformances are being actively addressed there should not be any issue. A thorough review of the nonconformance, including root cause and corrective action should be more important than how quickly the material can be processed.

Rob
 

Randy

Super Moderator
#27
We don't require that NC's be closed out prior to the registration audit. In order for a CA to be effective it may take some time for it to happen.
 
T

tlonkey

#28
I have been through several audits of all types; QS / TS / AS / ISO and never had any audit held up because of an open internal audit nonconformance. As long as I could show that I was following my procedure for internal audits and could provide evidence that our action plan to correct the problem was being addressed by the appropriate persons I never had any auditor question why the nonconformance was not yet closed.

Tlonkey
 
J

joshua_sx1

#29
...there is a “Corrective Action” that is supposedly eliminating the cause of nonconformity to prevent recurrence… and there is a “Correction” that is supposedly eliminating a detected nonconformity…

...now, a competent Auditor also knew the difference between a “long term Corrective Action plan” with a “short term CA plan”…

…combine them both, and you’ll learn why some audit NCR's, which cannot be closed prior to registration, are still acceptable… while others not…
 
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