Internal Audit Team - The number of internal auditors a company should have

S

SwidenS

#1
Is there a standard or a recommendation regarding the number of internal auditors a company should have? For instance a company of 1000 employees should have an audit team of X members? (Or, given full-time and part-time auditors X hours of audit hours per month?)

I have looked at ISO 10011-1 and cannot find anything. I also have not been able to get a response from RAB.

Does anyone know if there is a guideline, what it is or where I can find it?

Thank you in advance.

Shari
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor

Marc

Fully vaccinated are you?
Staff member
Admin
#2
There's no standard requirement. It depends upon your company needs and how you want to structure things. You could have 1 auditor who only audits. Or you could have 50 auditors who each audit once a year.

I'm sure you will get some replies from others who have come up with a 'rule of thumb' for their comnpany - but again be warned - what is right for 1 company isn't always right for another.
 
G
#3
There is no rule of thumb regarding the number of internal auditors, but in an article in Quality online I read that Dan Bridget (Lead Assessor) estimated that for a company employing 100 - 300 people, 10 - 12 internal auditors should cover it, other articles I have read elsewhere mention anything from 1 per 50 employees to 5 for medium sized manufacturing plant, so all things being equal it really depends on the size and complexity of your operation and the experience and time availability of your internal auditors.
 
Q

Qualiman

#4
SwedenS:

Is my point of view that despite of there is no place where a written rule is given related this topic, is not covenient having only ONE internal Auditor, because..Who will audit s/he ?.

If I were you probably would apply the rule of having from 3 to 5 folks for a micro/small company, less than 50 souls and 5 to 10 folks for a medium sized company,let's say less than 200. For bigger plants it is really a matter of making numbers.

I have 2 more points of view :

1) If you have a very limited number of auditors (supose 2 or 3) you have the risk that they would have another urgent duties related their own activities during the week of the audit,hence the importance of having enough people (not to many of course)in order to face that kind of emergencies.

2) I am convinced that in the case of companies that have the problem that the majority of people is not awere or convinced to change their attitude towards quality or any other type of possitive change they consider "allien or strange", the internal audits would have a very helpful "double role" function: One >> Being a very professional auditor during the audit and, of course, avoiding the role of consultant during the audit, but afterwords s/he will be a "change promoter" in his own department in order to push the closing of non conformances, taking care of going deep to find the root causes of problems and the application of preventive actions, convinced that is better to "wash the dirty cloth at home" before external visitors arrive. This second "personality" has been in my experience very very helpful in small/medium sized companies, making possible the establishment of a "quality gang" in most of the cases more effective than an "official" Quality Comitee, that also in most of the cases is only a corporative "show". The activities of quality gang after the internal audits do not brake any "judge and jury" or any other rule.

Qualiman
 

barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#5
All in all there is no rule...just opinions, and i believe probably as many opinions as there are people...

I will be addressing a convention in November on this issue including contract-vs-inhouse auditors..it all falls under the same umbrella...anyway, the attendance is expected to be at max....or close to it..WHY do you think that is?
Its a very difficult call, and all you can do to address it, is trial and error...what works for you, your company and the audit team at....at this moment in time...????

Far too many factors to give a rule ...

BTW..the session is on what to consider and how to make that decision.....anyone got some comments to add to that?


[This message has been edited by barb butrym (edited 12 March 2000).]
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
I Is it required to have a Lead Internal Auditor on the Internal Audit Team? ISO 14001 Internal Auditing 3
Q What are the benefits of a Cross-Functional Internal Audit Team? Internal Auditing 14
E Internal Audit for Project Management Team - Construction Industry Internal Auditing 8
J Internal Audit Teams - How big the audit team should be and who should be on it General Auditing Discussions 6
F Advantages of a designated Internal Audit team? General Auditing Discussions 7
Crusader Your Internal Audit Team: Internal or Hired External? Outsourcing Internal Audits Internal Auditing 100
J Internal Audit Team - Small or Large Pool? Internal Auditing 7
B Our QS9000 audit team has been using checklists to perform internal audits Internal Auditing 37
J Outsourced Internal Audit requirements for Aerospace Suppliers AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 21
D Number of people to be interviewed during an internal audit? Internal Auditing 6
Q Easy CARs for Internal Audit ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 14
A Internal audit plan and processes for ISO 14001:2015 ISO 14001:2015 Specific Discussions 3
C API Q1 internal audit report Internal Auditing 3
P Filled in F48/F49 for internal audit ISO 17025:2017 Internal Auditing 2
J Internal audit random sampling methodology Internal Auditing 2
G Organizing internal audit program for an Integrated QHSE Management System Internal Auditing 13
W How do you phrase your internal audit questions? Internal Auditing 3
M IATF - Internal Audit 3 year span Internal Auditing 4
Q ISO 9001-2015 Internal audit finding Internal Auditing 14
lanley liao How to understand this words that the planning of internal audit shall take into consideration the results of previous audits? Oil and Gas Industry Standards and Regulations 10
A Add MDSAP to Internal Audit Schedule Medical Device Related Regulations 0
J IATF 16949 Internal Audit question - Auditor's responsibility Internal Auditing 6
S IATF 16949 Internal Audit Example IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 15
R AS9100D internal audit checklist or ISO 9001 2015 to AS9100 D AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 2
M ISO 13485:2016 internal audit checklist Medical Device and FDA Regulations and Standards News 8
A Internal Audit Questions ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 11
salaheddine96 Internal audit planning Internal Auditing 2
M ISO 9001 Major Nonconformance Internal Audit Schedule/COVID-19 ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 18
E MDR internal audit Internal Auditing 1
U Internal Auditor not trained but done Audit for some process Nonconformance and Corrective Action 5
B Looking for 10 Internal Audit Online Training Participants ISO 17025 related Discussions 2
H AS9100 Checklist for Internal Audit needed AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 2
A What are the pros and cons of using an audit software for internal auditing? General Auditing Discussions 7
F Internal Audit before Pre-Assessment ISO 17025 related Discussions 2
Q Internal audit plan template Internal Auditing 12
L Internal audit during COVID-19 restrictions ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 5
O ISO13485 implementation - Are internal audits expected before stage 1 audit? Design and Development of Products and Processes 3
B Using Unreleased Documents & Process Maps for Internal Audit purposes ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 12
N Small Company - Internal audit process - Who does the audit? Internal Auditing 16
J Does anyone have an excel IATF 16949 Internal Audit checklist I could use? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 7
G Addressing Non-Conformances from an Internal Audit that are not product related ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 11
S Internal audit discrepancy - We missed a few audits that were scheduled Internal Auditing 12
Raffy ISO 14001 9.2.2 Internal Audit Programme Content Internal Auditing 10
N Internal Audit Schedule – Who gets to set the schedule? Internal Auditing 16
V IATF 16949 9.2.2.1 Internal Audit Program - "Process Changes" IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 11
G Non Conformance During ISO 9001 Audit - Not All Internal Audits Completed General Auditing Discussions 19
B Using external FDA and ISO 13485 audit as internal audit Internal Auditing 6
T Internal Audit Schedule when Hiring Out Internal Auditing 7
D ISO 9001:2015 Internal Audit Training Advice Internal Auditing 10
M Internal audit consultant ISO 13485 (English speaker) Consultants and Consulting 3

Similar threads

Top Bottom