Internal Audits - Necessary before Stage 1 Audit?

[kellyjo]

Hi,
I'm new here. I work for a teeny-tiny (myself and the two bosses) metal fab/manufacturing shop. We are working towards our 9001:2008 certification. We have paid a "consulting company" to help us. There's one spot I'm confused....Do we HAVE to do internal audit before out stage one audit is done?
One piece of their information is saying no and the rest is beating it into my head to have an internal audit done beforehand.
The reason this is a concern is our stage 1 is scheduled for next week. We have fallen slightly behind due to increase in work. I have all my procedures and quality manual done. Thanks for any help.

 

[qusys]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

Yes , you shall have a cycle of internal audit for your QMS processes and have the results as one of input of the mgmt review. THe ISO 9001 speaks about audit (internal/external)

 

[kellyjo]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

Thanks for the reply.
I was told by our consulting company to do the management review right away, before the internal audit... this is why I'm so confused

 

[AndyN]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

Hi,
I'm new here. I work for a teeny-tiny (myself and the two bosses) metal fab/manufacturing shop. We are working towards our 9001:2008 certification. We have paid a "consulting company" to help us. There's one spot I'm confused....Do we HAVE to do internal audit before out stage one audit is done?
One piece of their information is saying no and the rest is beating it into my head to have an internal audit done beforehand.
The reason this is a concern is our stage 1 is scheduled for next week. We have fallen slightly behind due to increase in work. I have all my procedures and quality manual done. Thanks for any help.

Yes! One of the reasons a CB does a stage 1 is to confirm some basics, like internal audits, management review are in place and working. Put off you stage 1, right now. You probably won't incur any last minute fees, if the auditor is local. Have your consultant do their homework.

 

[AndyN]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

Thanks for the reply.
I was told by our consulting company to do the management review right away, before the internal audit... this is why I'm so confused

Wrong way around! You have to do audits before management review since a vital bit of information will be missing! You will then possibly get 2 ncs, one for no audits, one for an incomplete Management Review, not considering internal audits as an input! You seem to be on the right track...

 

[kellyjo]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

Thanks Andy. One more thing I should have included (sorry)..our registrar called last week and spoke to my boss about our concerns. She told him she'd only be looking at the 6 required documents and our QM.

 

[AndyN]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

Thanks Andy. One more thing I should have included (sorry)..our registrar called last week and spoke to my boss about our concerns. She told him she'd only be looking at the 6 required documents and our QM.

That's not compliant with the requirements of the accreditation standard ISO/IEC 17021, which defines what has to be done at the stage 1. Are you using an ANAB accredited Registrar?

 

[kellyjo]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

ummmm, good question. Let me go look!!

 

[kellyjo]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

They are accredited.

 

[AndyN]

Re: Internal audit, necessary before stage 1 audit

I have ISO/IEC 17021 open in front of me and, under section 9.2.3.1 it lists a - g, items to be verified, a) being documentation (not just 6 procedures and QM) and g) being audits, management review...

You may wish to call a halt to this and regroup, based on what you're being lead to believe and what your auditor is prepared for.