@Candi1024 That was an edit that was inappropriate and has been corrected. I take full responsibility for it. I did it prior to him being identified as a real auditor. There was a discussion between the moderators and I was one who thought he was a troll, both from his abrasiveness and the fact that, as I say below, He came in like a bat out of hell and immediately started churning things up. There are people on the internet these days that do register in a discussion forum with the
intent to try to "stir things up".
In addition, remember that Elsmar has been online for over 23 years (less the 10 months offline issue). We have seen people come to the forum, register 2 or 3 accounts, and then start posting against each other. If I remember some years ago we identified a "Jim Wade" who did this. I don't know what his motives were.
However - I offer this public response:
It is true that
@Sidney Vianna and
@AndyN can be a bit opinionated and at times egotistical and combative, as some people over the years have said
I can be - I have been and realize that reality. Andy and I have exchanged a few "disagreements from time to time. And I can understand Sidney - In large part I agree with him that over the years things in the certification business have deteriorated.
@Randy and I have had some significant disagreements in his posting "style" and, at times, over his "attitude" in some posts. I will say I would never say Randy isn't extremely knowledgable - I believe he is not only knowledgeable, but I am sure he audits much like I did in my day. In small companies I gave a lot of leniency - I would not have made a big deal out of an internal auditor not being "totally and unambiguously" dissociated from "auditing his/her own work". See the embedded quote bellow.
On the other hand, "Yukon" was, in my opinion, not professional, was intentionally antagonistic, combative and, I believe, purposefully disruptive in general. He came in like a bat out of hell and immediately started churning things up. It degrades the forum and its reputation when pissing matches occur. My actions aren't always what everyone agrees with, but I challenge anyone to try to monitor and maintain an internet discussion forum, not to mention for as long as I have.
Personally, I wish the forum would totally "run its self", which to some degree it does, but... After over 23 years of much of this, I don't like to have to get involved in monitoring and mediating in threads like this one. I'm just getting too old for some of this stuff. And unfortunately a topic like "auditor independence" or, as another example, discussions on "risk", bore me because I first dealt with them in the 1980's and over many years between then and now. I used to be quite prolific in posting, but these days for me it's obvious I don't too often get involved, especially in what I consider "common - Asked and Answered in other discussion threads" discussions.
There are several people here I depend on for a "reality check" from time to time.
@Randy is one. E.g.:
Nope, as a 3rd party I've seen it, validated the objectivity and impartiality of the process and all the gobblety goo that goes with it, said nice job, and moved on to more serious stuff
This is reality. Randy audits like I audited.
@Jen Kirley is another.
@Big Jim is another. I watch their interactions to get cues to things going amiss here. In this case, the need for a reality check with regard to what Mr. "Yukon" was posting, was warranted, in my opinion. In part this also has to do with information being posted being important here. Many people who are new to their profession, or are not "experienced", need a way to be confident that what is being posted is, in fact, good information. I made a specific "user group" here to address that. People with the "Trusted" badge are people I have personally vetted for their professionalism and their posts being accurate. I do consider the moderators and the admins here to be in the "Trusted" group.
If we did not address what we believe to be inaccurate information, I believe it would be bad for Elsmar particularly with regard to "Trust" that the information is just that - That a person can Trust information here. The problem, so to speak, is how we do this. I think we all do our best here. I understand that from time to time there will be people who disagree with what we do. After all these years I know I cannot please everyone. That is reality.
--------------------------------------
Edit: Minor additions/clarifications.
