Is it OK to do a Gage R&R With A CMM?

[carriek]

I was auditing a plant recently and was shock to find that the was doing their gage R&R's with their cmm. I did not question it at the time because i was not real familar with the msa guidelines but would not a gage R&R require actually people doing the trial on the gage (this was a go/nogo fixture.) Can someone please help me out on this? thanks

 

[BRoyal]

If you are not familiar with gage R&R and measurement system analysis, these items can be a little confusing.

Take the time to read through the MSA manual and ask questions of you fellow auditors. You company should also be able to provide some training and guidance on this.

Also, this forum can provide a wealth of information; it's pretty easy to do a search.

I suspect Mr. Dyer is under the impression you are a third party auditor. I would hope this is not so, however, if it is so, please get in touch with your company for some more detailed and thorough training before conducting future audits.

Many of us who frequent this site are auditors who take our work pretty seriously and spend a lot of time studying and trying to improve our knowledge and skills.

Oh, Mitutoyo offers excellent classes on MSA from time to time that will be helpful also.

Good luck.

 

[Marc]

Re: Gage R&r

Originally posted by carriek
I was auditing a plant recently and was shock to find that the was doing their gage R&R's with their cmm. I did not question it at the time because i was not real familar with the msa guidelines but would not a gage R&R require actually people doing the trial on the gage (this was a go/nogo fixture.) Can someone please help me out on this?

Can you give me some more info? Tell me exactly what they were doing. I am assuming that you are saying they had a gage (let's say a calipers) and were doing the R&R with a CMM which doesn't make sense to me. Some more details may help us figure out what's going on.

 

[D.Scott]

Sticking my nose in again -

Sounds to me like Carriek is repeating the old question - "Can you do a gage R&R on a measurement system without including the operators". With a CMM, I am assuming he is saying the part is placed and the equipment does all the work - there is no operator variance.

A very short and simple answer is yes, it can be done. BRoyal is right when he says there is good information in the MSA manual, and definately talk to your fellow auditors. I repeat the recommendation of Mitutoyo as an excellent resource.

Don't be discouraged in looking for advice here either. Some great information is available here from some of the best in the quality field.

Dave

 

[Marc]

Yup - And if it is being manually manipulated to each point then the operators would have to be used.