Is "Quality" just "Fitness for Use"?

Mikael

Quite Involved in Discussions
#41
CSR = Corporate Social Responsibillity, Here is an important link and example: http://www.unglobalcompact.org/AboutTheGC/TheTenPrinciples/index.html

Concerning Customization, there exist seval different versions depending on to which extent the product is produced with the customer!

"As a consequence to this you would have to judge the quality of a reccomendation or warning."
Exspensive, but it is possible and more valid than measure "satisfaction".
Cannot believe that some companies still do these "on a scale from 1-10, how satisfied are you..." - bvadr... :frust:

Jim this is the place to overthink things, where else to go :)!
 
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Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#42
Jim this is the place to overthink things, where else to go :)!
I'm not trying to stifle the discussion, but I think it's pretty easy to go from this:



To this:



If you're not careful.

There are perceptions of quality that we can't overcome, and this thread demonstrates the concept. If a person won't buy a product for a reason that's completely unrelated to its utility, and the reason for not buying is the potential customer's neurosis, there isn't much we can do about it, and we shouldn't spend a lot of time fretting over it. You can't please everyone, and trying to will only cause pain and suffering. We should identify unreasonable customers and gleefully send them to the competition.

If we spend too much time worrying about what "quality" means, it's an indication that we don't understand the market, and the fact that we'll never sell products to everyone. If you know what your market wants and you can provide it in an economically feasible way, you've discovered all you need to know about quality.
 

bobdoering

Stop X-bar/R Madness!!
Trusted Information Resource
#43
You can't please everyone, and trying to will only cause pain and suffering. We should identify unreasonable customers and gleefully send them to the competition.
So true.:agree1: When DJ'ing, I send the Bridezillas to the competition. Not worth any amount of money to me.
 
R

Rinascimento

#44
If we spend too much time worrying about what "quality" means, it's an indication that we don't understand the market, and the fact that we'll never sell products to everyone. If you know what your market wants and you can provide it in an economically feasible way, you've discovered all you need to know about quality.
It's a pity my company's filters prevented your graphics coming through.

I didn't think anyone was worrying. It is helpful to think about the philosophical underpinnings of the various approaches.
Knowing what your market wants is one thing. But as we are not "one man bands" it is also necessary to be able express these in terms to your colleagues, customers, and suppliers as a communication of facts and information.
 
J

JaneB

#45
It's a pity my company's filters prevented your graphics coming through.
Yes it is, because they made a great point and were rather funny. To help:
'From this' was next to a picture of someone wiping their child's mouth at the table with a napkin/serviette

'To this' appeared next to an extremely complicated gizmo/machine with all kinds whizbang levers and doovers and pulleys'n' stuff, labelled as a 'Self-Operating Napkin'.
 
R

Rinascimento

#46
Hi Jane,

While the graphics are doubtless amusing as an example of overengineering a solution, they are at a tangent to the the question in the OP.

The question was pitched at the meta-level of the definition of the concept of quality, to which there are various responses coming from different philosophical viewpoints.

Jim’s “definition” (which I place in quotes precisely because it does not qualify as i.e. does not have the qualities of – a definition) would have us not concern ourselves with articulating the meaning of quality, presumably because we know from customer response whether our product/service does indeed contain the necessary quality.

This reminds me of the story of the manager who was asked how his staff knew they were doing a good job, to which he said, “My staff know they’re doing a good job when I’m not balling them out!” This performance “requirement” seems to be at the same level as the Stanley Marcus “definition”.
 
R

Rinascimento

#47
I will add one of the Wikipedia definitions of "definition". This is the most appropriate one to use.
"An intensional definition, also called a connotative definition, specifies the necessary and sufficient conditions for a thing being a member of a specific set. Any definition that attempts to set out the essence of something.... is an intensional definition."
 

BradM

Staff member
Admin
#48
Knowing what your market wants is one thing. But as we are not "one man bands" it is also necessary to be able express these in terms to your colleagues, customers, and suppliers as a communication of facts and information.
You have a reasonable point, here. However, I would surmise it's not that simple.

Take McDonalds. At 12:35pm on a particular day, five different customers will enter the eating establishment with five different wants/needs, and five different assessments of quality. One is did the food arrive quickly, another is if the floors are clean, another is if the bathroom is stocked/cleaned. The customer in drive thru has yet more assessments, ranging from speed, to order accuracy, to having everything in the bag, etc.

McDonalds then passes a different set of quality assessments to their suppliers, etc.

I contend that it is exactly about knowing what your customer wants. As that... becomes your measure of quality. Knowing what the customer wants then necessitates quality requirements up and down the Supply Chain.
 
J

JaneB

#50
they are at a tangent to the question in the OP.
I think only the OP can determine that ;)

Jim’s “definition” (which I place in quotes precisely because it does not qualify as i.e. does not have the qualities of – a definition) would have us not concern ourselves with articulating the meaning of quality, presumably because we know from customer response whether our product/service does indeed contain the necessary quality.
? :confused: Jim isthe original poster.

You can pitch a definition at any level you want, meta or otherwise. But when the rubber meets the road/when it is all boiled down/the bottom line is//whatever cliche you want to use (it is Friday afternoon here)... I think Jim's quote from Neiman Marcus captured the essence very well indeed.

It may come down to simply a difference in opinion. I'd a heap rather have something that your average person can understand and relate to (as an understanding of the meaning of that elusive term quality, whether or not it fits the criteria of 'definition') than one that is academically correct, but largely incomprehensible to the average person and/or takes considerable mental effort to decode and remember. Is that simple? Yup.

But comparing that definition/description/quality meaning/whatever to the manager in the story you quote I think is way off beam. I don't think it's a valid comparison.

It is helpful to think about the philosophical underpinnings of the various approaches.
Yes - I think that's what Jim was doing.

And yes of course one has to be able to express the real meaning of that term at greater levels of detail, and in many different formats/terms etc., depending upon the purpose, audience and application. The average engineer needs a little more to work on than the Marcus-statement, I think.

But I'd still say that having a Marcus-type statement sitting at the top of it all (as the 'quick and dirty meaning' in an organisation) than one that may be correct, but that few people really understand, let alone use.
 
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