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ISO 17024, clauses 4.3.8. and 5.1.1.

Tallinec

Involved In Discussions
#1
Hello.
Please, give your idea, what is the difference between "Certification activities" (clause 4.3.8) and "The certification body activities" (clause 5.1.1) in the standard?

4.3.8. Certification activities shall be structured and managed so as to safeguard impartiality.
5.1.1. The certification body activities shall be structured and managed so as to safeguard impartiality.
 
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Jen Kirley

Quality and Auditing Expert
Staff member
Admin
#2
I don't have a copy of this standard, but I can offer that in 4.3.8 the term Certification is a noun used to describe things that are done to certify other organizations. This means the audit from the customer service stage to closing activities.

In contrast, 5.1.1 is talking about the certification body as an organization that performs the activities - along with many other activities to include issuance/revocation of certificates, arbitration during complaints and/or intervention during disputes.

Impartiality is necessary in both cases. The Certified Body organization must plan and execute its activities (structure and manage) so as to avoid personnel from being affected by inside information, previous experience or other factors. The CB I worked for had a time frame in which an auditor could not audit an organization where he/she had been employed or engaged as a consultant, for a defined period. The client might be given the right to turn down an auditor, even once that time frame had passed, based on a sense of over-familiarity. I had that happen to me once.

I hope this makes sense!
 

Tallinec

Involved In Discussions
#3
I don't have a copy of this standard, but I can offer that in 4.3.8 the term Certification is a noun used to describe things that are done to certify other organizations. This means the audit from the customer service stage to closing activities.

In contrast, 5.1.1 is talking about the certification body as an organization that performs the activities - along with many other activities to include issuance/revocation of certificates, arbitration during complaints and/or intervention during disputes.
Thanks for your answer.
Standard ISO 17024 "...contains principles and requirements for a body certifying persons (!) against specific requirements...", but does not cover certification of organizations.
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#4
Hello.
Please, give your idea, what is the difference between "Certification activities" (clause 4.3.8) and "The certification body activities" (clause 5.1.1) in the standard?
Some of the "certification activities" might be outsourced, so, technically, it would be outside of the CB activities. That's my guess.
 

Tallinec

Involved In Discussions
#5
Some of the "certification activities" might be outsourced, so, technically, it would be outside of the CB activities. That's my guess.
I think, that the matter is not in „outsources CB activities“/“own CB activities“ because Certification Boby in both cases shall act within certification process in the same manner (in accordance with ISO 17024) and „take full responsibility for all outsourced work” (clause 6.3.2.a. of ISO 17024).

I suppose, that “Certification activities" are the activities within certification process (clause 3.1. of ISO 17024). So certification activities are “the activities by which a certification body determines that a person fulfils certification requirements”.

And "Certification Boby activities" cover not only activities within certification process, but activities outside the certification process too. For example, contacts with governmental and local tax bodies, involvement in public matters. So „certification body activities“ has much wider meaning than “certification activities”. May be that the difference.
 
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