A Management Review Story!
Subject: Re: Management Responsibility /Syed/Bradley
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 12:56:02 -0600
From: ISO Standards Discussion
From: Mark Bradley
Subject: RE: Management Responsibility /Syed/Bradley
> Hi,
>
> I am working as Quality Assurance Coordinator/Quality Management Rep. in
> a group in Doha, Qatar (Gulf/Middle East Region). I have started this
> since Oct '98. The group itself is chaired by Chairman, who is the only
> and final authority for providing resources. And only limited
> authorities have been given to company managers. There are 15 companies
> in Our Group.
>
> The problem is Our Chairman has a very busy schedule and I did initiate
> Group Management Review Council as reqd. in 4.1.3 of ISO 9002:94, but
> despite agenda were distributed, he had to leave for some business trip.
> As defined in the procedure, his brother, i.e. Vice-Chairman was
> supposed to chair the meeting, but he refused to attend the meeting
> stating that it was not his duty to attend the meeting.
>
> As all members of this review council, i.e. Executive Council for
> Quality, were very disappointed and started to leave. This caused a
> company-wide demotivation and as MR, I am trying to find some new
> strategies.
>
> These are:
>
> 1. To implement ISO 9002:94, from Company Manager Level without
> involving Chairman and Vice-Chairman even they are only and final
> authorities to provide resources (i.e. mentioning them as NOT in
> Scope).
> 2. If this is not possible, can we send them meeting minutes to take
> action without reviewing and discussing with Council members?
>
> I hope that you can understand the situation. Please give any suggestion.
>
> Syed Muhammad Ali, QA Coordinator/QMR.
I would suggest the following:
Create an ISO Implementation Team that has as it's members an individual from each of the departments. This team is your Action group. Meet frequently and use this team to coordinate your implementation of ISO. Meet with upper management quarterly to fill them in on the actions of the Implementation team. This worked well at a company I worked for in getting QS-9000, and I am using it presently at my present company to pursue ISO9002.
You still meet the requirements this way, but don't have to depend on upper management to be at all the meetings necessary to implement ISO.
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Subject: Re: Q: Management Responsibility /Syed/Paris
Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 12:43:12 -0600
From: ISO Standards Discussion
Subject: Re: Q: Management Responsibility /Syed/Paris
Interesting post, Mr. Ali. I've had similar experiences, and one former client appears to be about to lose registration because the CEO felt that when the certificate was on the wall and the consultant (me) left, his involvement was over.... despite all the training I gave him to the contrary. He's since cancelled three review meetings, and the surveillance audit is pending. It's not reassuring.
The standard says "The supplier's management with executive responsibility shall review the quality system at defined intervals." It does not require management review MEETINGS... although obviously auditors like to see them, and such meetings are the most effective way for management to do the review. I've spoken with a few registrars about this particular issue and they say that an acceptable method IS to have reports sent to executive management for their review, but that in order to meet ISO 9000 the managers must do more than just RECEIVE the reports. There must be proof that they are reviewing the information and actually feeding the results of that review back into the system for improvement. For example, simply initialing the reports as "received" is not sufficient. This is difficult to do from a distance --- but not impossible.
There is no ISO9000 requirement that the managers be sitting in the same room. ISO must be flexible enough to accomodate modern office communications (teleconferencing, internet, etc.) Perhaps you can develop a means to satisfy the standard without having your CEO physically present. He must be PSYCHOLOGICALLY present, though.... and it's unclear from your post if he's really bought into the program or not. You say he's "busy." If he really wants the benefits of ISO (other than the certificate and marketing advantages) he will incorporate the needs of ISO into his schedule, even if it makes him busier. Then there's the question of will he be too busy to be physically present during the AUDIT, which IS required!
>As all members of this review council, i.e. Executive Council for
>Quality, were very disappointed and started to leave. This caused a
>company-wide demotivation and as MR, I am trying to find some new >strategies.
This illustrates the greatest harm uninvolved executive management can have.
>These are:
> >1. To implement ISO 9002:94, from Company Manager Level without involving Chairman and Vice-Chairman even they are only and
> >2. final authorities to provide resources (i.e. mentioning them as NOT in Scope).
This is completely NOT something you want to do, and will likely be a major nonconformance in an audit. Again, the standard calls for "The supplier's management with executive responsibility " to do the review. Excluding them from the scope is like excluding the entire 4.1 element from the scope, and that constitutes a missing element --- a major nonconformance.
Your second option, sending minutes, MAY work as I discussed--- but it will be very tricky, and will still require your CEO's absolute involvement, even if it's from a plane or 2000 miles away.
[This message has been edited by Marc Smith (edited 04-18-99).]