ISO 9001:2015 4.4.1 (c) Process Effectiveness

[Kronos147]

As part of our response, we need to provide a list of key processes that we will establish measurements of effectiveness for.

What are your processes? Who are the process owners? What do they shoot for? Is that already one of the organizational objectives?

Does any process take ownership of monitoring customer satisfaction? Surely that is one of the measures. What about On Time Delivery? First Pass Yield? Parts Per Million/defect rates? Percentage to goal against internal programs (Internal Audit, Management Review, Preventive Maintenance, Training)?

Also, when you think about these measurements, remember the S.M.A.R.T. acronym; Specific, Measurable, Attainable, Relevant, and Time-Bound. Evidence-based decision making requires trend analysis.

 

[stevegyro]

What Mr. Sidney Vianna says!

Any ‘quality professional’ who has been in the field of ‘manufacturing’ for any amount of time, will probably agree that it is very difficult to believe Sales people, or the “bean counters”.

Oddly enough, the Sales people and bean counters are at the ‘Headmasters’ station steering the ship.
The autonomy they are ‘graced with’ often becomes a pool of red ink, and finger pointing, usually at the wrong departments!

We all understand the salesman’s motto:
“Nothing happens before the Sale” but ...
Until Salesmen/Sales-Engineers are held be accountable by the Quality Team, any of us are doomed to experience that “last minute scramble” to get the goods out the back door.
Quality compromised? Of course!

Sometimes I have wondered if sales people are acting stupid (dumb like a fox) when they fail to understand specifications and contract obligations.
How convenient.

I would call BS on this. This may be a game for them, but people’s livelihoods are in the balance. Make no mistake about this please.

I have seen more than one family business, after forty years or so of success, “go down the tubes” hiring young ‘geniuses’ who do not possess depth of understanding, and mixing these new hires with ‘lifers’ (sales people who know the game too well and have been in the comfort zone too long).

In defense of sales people:
Sometimes Sales will need to promise a little more than the competition.
OK, so be it.
But IMHO if you can share those ‘stretched promises’ with your entire team, and certainly your Quality people, it can avoid last minute surprises.

We all know that last minute surprises lead to customer dissatisfaction, or worse, failures in the field.

Happy sailing!






Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Golfman25]

What Mr. Sidney Vianna says!

Any ‘quality professional’ who has been in the field of ‘manufacturing’ for any amount of time, will probably agree that it is very difficult to believe Sales people, or the “bean counters”.

Oddly enough, the Sales people and bean counters are at the ‘Headmasters’ station steering the ship.
The autonomy they are ‘graced with’ often becomes a pool of red ink, and finger pointing, usually at the wrong departments!

We all understand the salesman’s motto:
“Nothing happens before the Sale” but ...
Until Salesmen/Sales-Engineers are held be accountable by the Quality Team, any of us are doomed to experience that “last minute scramble” to get the goods out the back door.
Quality compromised? Of course!

Sometimes I have wondered if sales people are acting stupid (dumb like a fox) when they fail to understand specifications and contract obligations.
How convenient.

I would call BS on this. This may be a game for them, but people’s livelihoods are in the balance. Make no mistake about this please.

I have seen more than one family business, after forty years or so of success, “go down the tubes” hiring young ‘geniuses’ who do not possess depth of understanding, and mixing these new hires with ‘lifers’ (sales people who know the game too well and have been in the comfort zone too long).

In defense of sales people:
Sometimes Sales will need to promise a little more than the competition.
OK, so be it.
But IMHO if you can share those ‘stretched promises’ with your entire team, and certainly your Quality people, it can avoid last minute surprises.

We all know that last minute surprises lead to customer dissatisfaction, or worse, failures in the field.

Happy sailing!






Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

The problem is that if it's left to the quality and engineering people, nothing would ever get sold. There is always some issue or ambiguity. Some things you just don't know until you know them. I have seen prints go from relatively simple to impossible due trying to iron out every single detail. Each change makes matters worse and worse. The sales folks should be able to smooth the edges and get the thing moving to the order stage.

 

[John C. Abnet]

Good day @shanew;
Before we start making changes to the management system, let us first determine if your organization is actually non-conformant (remember, just because the auditor issues a non-conformance finding, does NOT mean the organization is non-conformant).
Can you please state specifically (actual verbiage) what the auditor's non-conformance finding says?

 

[Mike S.]

The problem is that if it's left to the quality and engineering people, nothing would ever get sold.

There are bad apples in every single area of human endeavor, no question. But if you think this is typical in a well-run organization, I disagree.

My experience is, working as a team, we can come to an agreement and make money and and still maintain our moral and legal responsibilities. It is usually when some key member of the team is not included in the process from the beginning that things hit snags along the way, and then that missing member is considered the "bad guy" when he/she points out that a requirement is not being met.

For example, the product reaches final inspection and is supposed to ship today. No one had QA review the contract in the beginning, so no one, until now, realized a FAI is required. Oops! That will take 3 days and some disassembly to accomplish. And suddenly it is Quality's fault that the part was delivered late, right?

 

[Lafir Ali]

Hi every one,
I have one doubt that, for to fulfill ISO 9001:2015, Clause No.5.3- "Roles, Responsibilities and Authorities", Every organization is having Organization chart and my question is it is need to develop hierarchy organization structure or we can express in any form, eg say: Roles, Responsibility and Authority Matrix covering all clause requirements.

Kindly clarify me

Thanks in Advance

 

[John Broomfield]

Hi every one,
I have one doubt that, for to fulfill ISO 9001:2015, Clause No.5.3- "Roles, Responsibilities and Authorities", Every organization is having Organization chart and my question is it is need to develop hierarchy organization structure or we can express in any form, eg say: Roles, Responsibility and Authority Matrix covering all clause requirements.

Kindly clarify me

Thanks in Advance

Lafir Ali,

You’re right. No need for an organization chart.

Your “Roles, Responsibility and Authority Matrix“ may do a much better job of defining authority than is common but avoid writing your management system documents around the standard.

Document the way your organization actually works as a process-based system instead.

You’ll find that it largely meets the requirements of the standard and where it doesn’t you can consult with top management so they delegate their authorities sufficient for others to fulfill their assigned responsibilities.

Please share your matrix here.

John

 

[normzone]

Golfman25 said:


" The problem is that if it's left to the quality and engineering people, nothing would ever get sold. "

At first glance I misread this as " if it's left to the quality and engineering people, no one would ever get laid"

I thought that a rather harsh judgement of our respective groups. Fortunately it is Friday, and my external audit has concluded, and the auditor has left the building.