Interesting Discussion ISO 9001:2024 - What should be changed in the next Edition of ISO 9001? - REVISION CANCELLED May 2021

[Wearerofmanyhats]

Sometimes @Sidney Vianna posts the stats.

it bums me out this is the last we saw of Marc, the legend. Hope he is well.

 

[Johnnymo62]

Marc passed away a year or two ago. There's an announcement somewhere in the forum.

 

[Sidney Vianna]

ISO 9001 Design Specification has been developed

committee.iso.org

"...ISO 9001 - The Design Specification has been circulated to the members of SC 2 for information.
As informed in the communique dated 03/05/2022, ISO/TC 176/SC 2/TG 5 was tasked with the development of a Design Specification for a future revision of ISO 9001. This task has now been completed and the Design Specification has been recently circulated to the members of SC 2 for information. An ad-hoc meeting of the SC 2 was called to discuss potential benefits and concerns of a revision of the standard before the next Systematic Review.

[Please note that the ISO/CEN directives do not address the development of a Design Specification, but that ISO/TC 176 has adopted this as good practice in advance of the development or revision of a standard. It also does not imply that a revision of ISO 9001 will automatically happen at this stage]...."

Let's see the developments from here and, especially, if such Design Specification will be made publicly available. The last one was as transparent as the nucleus of a black hole during an universal blackout, not mentioning the records that "validated" the adequacy of 9001:2015, against the design specification were kept more secretively than the Da Vinci Code. The works of TC 176 are, sometimes, more opaque than the secret deliberations of organizations such as Opus Dei.

 

[Paul Simpson]

ISO 9001 Design Specification has been developed

committee.iso.org

"...ISO 9001 - The Design Specification has been circulated to the members of SC 2 for information.
As informed in the communique dated 03/05/2022, ISO/TC 176/SC 2/TG 5 was tasked with the development of a Design Specification for a future revision of ISO 9001. This task has now been completed and the Design Specification has been recently circulated to the members of SC 2 for information. An ad-hoc meeting of the SC 2 was called to discuss potential benefits and concerns of a revision of the standard before the next Systematic Review.

[Please note that the ISO/CEN directives do not address the development of a Design Specification, but that ISO/TC 176 has adopted this as good practice in advance of the development or revision of a standard. It also does not imply that a revision of ISO 9001 will automatically happen at this stage]...."

Let's see the developments from here and, especially, if such Design Specification will be made publicly available. The last one was as transparent as the nucleus of a black hole during an universal blackout, not mentioning the records that "validated" the adequacy of 9001:2015, against the design specification were kept more secretively than the Da Vinci Code. The works of TC 176 are, sometimes, more opaque than the secret deliberations of organizations such as Opus Dei.

It is a wonder to me why individuals within TC 176 bother some times.

There is always a place for healthy cynicism. There is also a point when this cynicism becomes unhealthy and serves no one.

For those interested in seeing the design specification, please get involved through your national standards body.

Anybody else please continue to throw rocks from the sideline.

 

[Mike S.]

What do you mean "get involved"? Why on earth do we need to jump through hoops to be informed of what is going on?

 

[Sidney Vianna]

The “esprit de corps” demonstrated by some committees is unfreakingbelievable. They want to be considered above and beyond any criticism whatsoever. Their work can never be questioned despite evidence to the contrary. When confronted with factual data about the shortcomings, they blame the critics.

As mentioned SEVERAL TIMES in this very space, the “records” that would have demonstrated the adequacy of 9001:2015 against the design specification of the revision are as transparent as a block of depleted uranium.

The ISO 9001 Brand Integrity group, after several years of “existence” has not made its output widely available and, I am sure, many people in the ISO community would prefer that group had NEVER been created and want desperately it to go away without a trace. The mere existence of the group is a PUBLIC ADMISSION of problems surrounding the standard and the associated conformity assessment process. Credibility, confidence, assurance. All unsubstantiated claims that disperse in the wind of empty press releases.

Unfortunately, for them, this digital space here exists and is not subjected to the brainwashing promoted by some who like to carry water for committees and consider their work unassailable.

 

[qualitymanagerTT]

What do you mean "get involved"? Why on earth do we need to jump through hoops to be informed of what is going on?

What is your National Standards Body communicating?

 

[Jean_B]

It is a wonder to me why individuals within TC 176 bother some times.

There is always a place for healthy cynicism. There is also a point when this cynicism becomes unhealthy and serves no one.

For those interested in seeing the design specification, please get involved through your national standards body.

Anybody else please continue to throw rocks from the sideline.

My company is involved with the national standards body. Horizontal committee on medical devices. Our suppliers are often qualified by their ISO 9001 certification. Obviously we also know a fair deal about ISO 9001 as well, being the 'generic' Quality standard.
I requested the documents.
The documents are labelled confidential.
We are not in the right committee.
I cannot obtain the Design Specification, and am also not able to obtain SC2/N 1585.
The advice is to get involved with the quality management committee that is doing the work.

@Paul Simpson:
When is my sector as a user able to access this information, when we are involved with the national standards body?
Is that before it is approved for publication? Where is the outreach to us as a user?