ISO 9001 News ISO 9001:2025 - What should be changed in the next Edition of ISO 9001? - REVISION PROCEEDING- August 2023


Quite Involved in Discussions
The way im looking at this then is we have a 14001 certification here and an license to discharge from the UK enviroment agency therefore we are acting upon enviromental issues please see our other certification move on as ive already had it audited.

Mike S.

Happy to be Alive
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I bet it would be fun if a detective were to track these clowns who voted to add climate change to ISO and show us all how personally dedicated to minimizing their impact on climate change they are. :rolleyes: I betcha a cold one that they are like most of the climate change preachers who act like "the rules are for thee and not for me" and have 5 houses and fly in private jets, etc.

Olec Kovalevsky

If we exclude de more than 500.000 certificates in China, the number of registered organizations is decreasing every year.
It's the "market" working on the versions of 9001...
It's not exactly what shows the last figures on ISO MS certifications :

Number certificates
from providers took part in 2021 and 2022
variation totalvariation in %
ISO 9001:2015102467412652412
ISO 14001:20154850548572521
ISO 45001:20183671828307629
ISO/IEC 27001:2013673261154921
ISO 50001:2011&201826625661133

Furthermore, if we add all Services Standards that have been written these last 20 years, based on quality ISO 9001 fundamentals, we can easily see that Quality certification and Standardisation is alive !

Within this big picture ISO 9001 should try to keep the function of Lighthouse, to bring on the quality table and day to day work (detailed in other specific or sectors-driven standards) some concepts or issues emerging from world context evolution or deeper knowledge in system management or new tools including SW.

I think that customer experience, strategy alignment of processes, objective evidence of process control, use of SW tools ... and some others subjects outlined for ISO 9001 update are potentially beneficial for all ISO 9001 users, specially for contractors and small, medium and intermediate companies for which third party certification scheme has been invented ... Don't you think so ?


Super Moderator
The way im looking at this then is we have a 14001 certification here and an license to discharge from the UK enviroment agency therefore we are acting upon enviromental issues please see our other certification move on as ive already had it audited.
Don't get 'em confused, one's a duck and the other a duster.......Both have feathers but it stops there.

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly

The 2nd meeting of ISO 9001 Working Group (WG) 29 responsible for the revision of ISO 9001 took place virtually between 19th and 23rd February.
The WG29 work was focused on the disposition of the more than 500 comments on the ISO 9001 Working Draft (WD) in preparation for a ISO 9001 Committee Draft ballot. The meetings were well attended with good global representation from members and liaisons, and there were many interesting discussions.

Next steps will involve volunteers from the working group tidying up the accepted comments on the Online Standards Development platform, and preparing the ISO 9001 Committee Draft for issue to Technical Committee (TC) 176 Sub-committee (SC) 2 members.

Sidney Vianna

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That’s code for “people had suggestions for all kinds of crazy ideas”.

As someone who has been involved in the standards development process at both ISO TC mirror group as well as in the IAQG/AAQG, I have no doubt that, at the end of the day, the standard is the result of what the committee leadership wants. There is a kabuki theater where “volunteers” are led to believe they can contribute and participate, but a handful of people steer the document to what they want. Simple as that.

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Interesting to note that I can't find a Vision, Mission and Key initiatives for the TC 176 any longer (About). It used to be the following

The vision of ISO/TC 176 is that, through its worldwide acceptance and use, the ISO 9000 family of standards will provide an effective means for improving the performance of individual organizations and providing confidence to people and organizations that products (goods and services) will meet their expectations thereby enhancing trade, global prosperity and individual well-being.

ISO/TC 176's mission is to:
  • identify and understand user needs in the field of quality management;
  • develop standards that respond effectively to the expectations of users;
  • support implementation of these standards; and
  • facilitate meaningful evaluation of the resulting implementations using the ISO process to achieve international consensus and compatibility with other ISO/IEC management standards.
The ISO/TC 176 Key Strategies to achieve this vision and mission are:
  1. Provide for a clear understanding of the role of quality in relation to the management (leading and operating) of an organization and the application of related concepts and principles.
  2. Minimize proliferation of standards within the ISO 9000 family.
  3. Work towards minimizing the proliferation of standards in the field of quality management developed externally to TC 176 using a joint and cooperative approach with the ISO/IEC TCs and other bodies involved.
  4. Ensure the integrity of the ISO 9000 family of standards and provide for the integrity of their implementation and of the evaluation of their implementation.
  5. Maximize usefulness of the ISO 9000 family of standards, facilitating effective implementation together with other ISO/IEC management system standards, using a joint and cooperative approach with the other TCs involved.

On the page of SC2 (About ) we now have the following:

Our vision is:​

  • That our products should be recognized and respected worldwide, and used by organizations as an integral component of sustainable development initiatives.

Our mission is:​

  • To develop, maintain and support a portfolio of products that enable organizations to improve their performance and to benefit from the implementation of a robust quality management system.
  • To establish generic quality management system requirements that provide the foundations to build confidence in products and services delivered throughout the supply chain to organizations and people worldwide.
  • To provide guidance and support, where needed, to ensure the continued credibility of our products.

So, in a world where we have challenges and difficulties positioning modern quality management where it should be, in the boardroom of organizations and the credibility of ISO 9001 is questioned without mercy, as evidenced by the existence of an ISO-endorsed and ISO-sponsored ISO 9001 Brand Integrity group, they want to make their products part of sustainable development initiatives. To me, it seems a tremendous disconnect between the TC176 and the overwhelming majority of the target group for their products.

Let's remember that the statistics on sales, deployment and usage of ISO 9004 Quality of an organization, Guidance to achieve sustained success are as opaque as a lump of coal, painted in matte vantablack, on a moonless night, during a blackout. And, then, they ask why the chicken crossed the road.
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