ISO 9001 - when implementing customer requirement

[Graciel]

Hi! I'm used to work with IATF 16949 (automotive) standard, that checks how you attend customer specific requirements during the audit. Now, I'm working at a company where they are certificated ISO 9001 (they are not auto parts makers). One of their customer now has a standard which is similar to general motors BIQS standard. Which is taking a lot (a lot!!) Of changes in their process (all). My concern is: should I do same matrix (or sheet) to check customer specific requirements, as we do to attend IATF? Or can it be more simple? They have a different team working on this project,but at the same time, I'm responsible for QMS, which will be directly affected by this new standard. Also, my concern is if they started this project by also attending their internal change management procedure. am I right on this? Am I missing something else?
Thanks in advance.

 

[John Broomfield]

Please refer to the definition of quality assurance. You’ll see that your management system should deliver confidence that requirements will be fulfilled.

So, having taken on this new customer with unusual requirements your colleagues in sales and contract review were showing their confidence in the sufficiency of your quality planning to fulfill these additional requirements.

Were you part of this decision?

Either way, your colleagues are now depending on your quality planning process for changing the system so it addresses this new customer’s unusual requirements.

 

[John C. Abnet]

customer specific requirements

Good day @Graciel ;
I'm not sure I completely understand your question, but it is important to note that ISO 9001 has NO "customer specific requirements" requirement. The rules of IATF do not apply to an ISO 9001 QMS.

Hope this helps.
Be well.

 

[Ron Rompen]

John: I agree and at the same time disagree with your statement. Yes, there is no 'customer specific requirements' in the ISO standard, BUT there is a CSR from your customer, and of the two, the customer is the MUCH MORE stringent requirement. ISO 9001, IATF 16949, all these standards are GUIDELINES on how to setup and manage your QMS.....but the ultimate decision as to whether or not it is suitable will always be in the hands of your customer. Whether you have your ISO/IATF/BSI/VDA registration proudly displayed on your wall or not doesnt really matter at the end - it is whether or not your customer is satisfied you are doing what THEY want.
As an example - right after TS16949 was released, we had a customer who would not accept a PPAP dimensional report in the 'normal' format (the Excel spreadsheet that most of us use). Instead, they required that we use a specific document that THEY had created - and it couldn't be run on the computer, it HAD to be created manually (using a typewriter) on the document which they supplied (with as I recall, 6 carbon copies). It was a pain in the ass to use it, but it was the CUSTOMER requirement - so we had to do it, or lose them as a customer.

 

[Graciel]

I me

Good day @Graciel ;
I'm not sure I completely understand your question, but it is important to note that ISO 9001 has NO "customer specific requirements" requirement. The rules of IATF do not apply to an ISO 9001 QMS.

Hope this helps.
Be well.

Hello! I mean, if during 9001 audit, we can also be required to show, as a "change management" attendance, if we are altering our procedures, instructions etc according to this new csr from our customer. Also, another thing that occurred to me: during the cb audit we will be in transition of many of our internal procedures, instructions etc. He may find some new and old d ocuments (format,codes..etc) but my boss said that this shouldn't be a problem if we show to the auditor our plan (schedule) and why we are changing it.

 

[Graciel]

John: I agree and at the same time disagree with your statement. Yes, there is no 'customer specific requirements' in the ISO standard, BUT there is a CSR from your customer, and of the two, the customer is the MUCH MORE stringent requirement. ISO 9001, IATF 16949, all these standards are GUIDELINES on how to setup and manage your QMS.....but the ultimate decision as to whether or not it is suitable will always be in the hands of your customer. Whether you have your ISO/IATF/BSI/VDA registration proudly displayed on your wall or not doesnt really matter at the end - it is whether or not your customer is satisfied you are doing what THEY want.
As an example - right after TS16949 was released, we had a customer who would not accept a PPAP dimensional report in the 'normal' format (the Excel spreadsheet that most of us use). Instead, they required that we use a specific document that THEY had created - and it couldn't be run on the computer, it HAD to be created manually (using a typewriter) on the document which they supplied (with as I recall, 6 carbon copies). It was a pain in the ass to use it, but it was the CUSTOMER requirement - so we had to do it, or lose them as a customer.

Also, another thing that occurred to me: during the cb audit we will be in transition of many of our internal procedures, instructions etc. He may find some new and old d ocuments (format,codes..etc) but my boss said that this shouldn't be a problem if we show to the auditor our plan (schedule) and why we are changing it.

 

[John Broomfield]

John: I agree and at the same time disagree with your statement. Yes, there is no 'customer specific requirements' in the ISO standard, BUT there is a CSR from your customer, and of the two, the customer is the MUCH MORE stringent requirement. ISO 9001, IATF 16949, all these standards are GUIDELINES on how to setup and manage your QMS.....but the ultimate decision as to whether or not it is suitable will always be in the hands of your customer. Whether you have your ISO/IATF/BSI/VDA registration proudly displayed on your wall or not doesnt really matter at the end - it is whether or not your customer is satisfied you are doing what THEY want.
As an example - right after TS16949 was released, we had a customer who would not accept a PPAP dimensional report in the 'normal' format (the Excel spreadsheet that most of us use). Instead, they required that we use a specific document that THEY had created - and it couldn't be run on the computer, it HAD to be created manually (using a typewriter) on the document which they supplied (with as I recall, 6 carbon copies). It was a pain in the ass to use it, but it was the CUSTOMER requirement - so we had to do it, or lose them as a customer.

But we can see the power of normative standards to impose additional requirements when interpreting ISO 9001.

 

[John C. Abnet]

John: I agree and at the same time disagree with your statement. Yes, there is no 'customer specific requirements' in the ISO standard, BUT there is a CSR from your customer, and of the two, the customer is the MUCH MORE stringent requirement. ISO 9001, IATF 16949, all these standards are GUIDELINES on how to setup and manage your QMS.....but the ultimate decision as to whether or not it is suitable will always be in the hands of your customer. Whether you have your ISO/IATF/BSI/VDA registration proudly displayed on your wall or not doesnt really matter at the end - it is whether or not your customer is satisfied you are doing what THEY want.
As an example - right after TS16949 was released, we had a customer who would not accept a PPAP dimensional report in the 'normal' format (the Excel spreadsheet that most of us use). Instead, they required that we use a specific document that THEY had created - and it couldn't be run on the computer, it HAD to be created manually (using a typewriter) on the document which they supplied (with as I recall, 6 carbon copies). It was a pain in the ass to use it, but it was the CUSTOMER requirement - so we had to do it, or lose them as a customer.

Thanks for the feedback @Ron Rompen

@Jim Wynne summed it up in post #52 within the following link...
IATF 16949 Cl. 4.3.2 - Customer Requirements vs. Customer Specific Requirements

Be well.