ISO/AS Surveillance Audit - Minor for not updating my QA Manual to ISO 9001:2008

C

ChrissieO

#41
Because your CB auditor couldn't think of anything better to write an NC for?
Seriously, you should contest it with the CB's management. The auditor is wrong, plain and simple.
Andy

How do we stand with this one. We have not yet been given our 2008 status, and none of our auditors have undergone external 2008 training. It was a decision made at corporate level that there was no need for formal external transition training for internal auditors.

We have taken guidence from our Corporate Quality Leadership Gorup in the US (we are a very large international company) who have provided us with explanatory documentation and trianing material provided by IRCA to conduct in house training and I have been involved with the internal corporate quality group forums and discussion groups accross both Europe and worldwide relating to 2008.

I am currently conducting the training with our group of internal auditors but all of them will not of been trained by the time we have our next external auditor visit. Should they be auditing to 2000 or 2008 prior to us gaining our 2008 status.

Chrissie x
 
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Big Jim

Super Moderator
#42
Andy

How do we stand with this one. We have not yet been given our 2008 status, and none of our auditors have undergone external 2008 training. It was a decision made at corporate level that there was no need for formal external transition training for internal auditors.

We have taken guidence from our Corporate Quality Leadership Gorup in the US (we are a very large international company) who have provided us with explanatory documentation and trianing material provided by IRCA to conduct in house training and I have been involved with the internal corporate quality group forums and discussion groups accross both Europe and worldwide relating to 2008.

I am currently conducting the training with our group of internal auditors but all of them will not of been trained by the time we have our next external auditor visit. Should they be auditing to 2000 or 2008 prior to us gaining our 2008 status.

Chrissie x
On the training issue, there is nothing keeping you from doing a short training session in-house to cover the changes. You should be able to cover it in no more than two hours. You can even assign reading to them instead of group training. Obtain a "Summary of Changes" from your registrar for reading / training material. If you want, PM me and I will send you one (I have collected several from different registrars). The article about the changes from the January 09 issue of Quality Digest would work as well.

As to if they should be auditing to 2008 there seems to be some controversy. I think it is a good idea, but since there are no new requirements, I also believe that you do not need to.

My take on 8.2.2a "The organization shall conduct internal audits at planned intervals to determine whether the quality management system . . . conforms . . . to the requirements of this International Standard . . ." is that since there are no new requirements, if you audit to one, you have audited to the other. Your auditor or registration company may or may not agree.
 
C

ChrissieO

#43
On the training issue, there is nothing keeping you from doing a short training session in-house to cover the changes. You should be able to cover it in no more than two hours. You can even assign reading to them instead of group training. Obtain a "Summary of Changes" from your registrar for reading / training material. If you want, PM me and I will send you one (I have collected several from different registrars). The article about the changes from the January 09 issue of Quality Digest would work as well.

As to if they should be auditing to 2008 there seems to be some controversy. I think it is a good idea, but since there are no new requirements, I also believe that you do not need to.

My take on 8.2.2a "The organization shall conduct internal audits at planned intervals to determine whether the quality management system . . . conforms . . . to the requirements of this International Standard . . ." is that since there are no new requirements, if you audit to one, you have audited to the other. Your auditor or registration company may or may not agree.
Thanks for your reply.

Our training is approx 2 hours, going throught the updates and then through the process approach training supplied by our corporate quality team, which in turn I think was supplied by IRCA with a short test paper at the end.

I am doing it as discussion based and only training 2 auidtors per session as I feel that as it is discussion based any more than 2 could become distracting and out of control.

All our internal auditors were originally trained externally so I feel that 2 hours update is sufficient and like you feel that as there are no "new" requirements just clarification on some points is all that is necessary

Chrissie x
 

cbearden

Involved In Discussions
#44
Just for Clarification.....
To Go from ISO9001:2000 to ISO9001:2008, all I have to do is take out the references to the 2000 standard????....meaning, I can either reference the 2008 standard or just reference (Our QMS)????

I'm just trying to make sure I'm on the same page....

Thanks!!
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#45
Just for Clarification.....
To Go from ISO9001:2000 to ISO9001:2008, all I have to do is take out the references to the 2000 standard????....meaning, I can either reference the 2008 standard or just reference (Our QMS)????

I'm just trying to make sure I'm on the same page....

Thanks!!
Just use "ISO 9001." Remove all approval year references. That's it.

Stijloor.
 

Big Jim

Super Moderator
#47
Just use "ISO 9001." Remove all approval year references. That's it.

Stijloor.
I don't agree. Although for many if not most, that might be enough, you should go a bit further to make sure.

You should confirm that your documentation, understanding, and practice match the changed wording, that you have not drifted off in the wrong direction as feared by those that determined the rewording was necessary.
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#48
You should confirm that your documentation, understanding, and practice match the changed wording, that you have not drifted off in the wrong direction as feared by those that determined the rewording was necessary.
If the processes and the system drifted off course, they were not in conformance with ISO 9000:2000 either.
 
V

Vic de Beer

#49
:topic:I know that this is not related to this partiqular thread, however, I started reading a thread about having 1 manual for 2 branches of a company , even though the 2 have nothing in common as far as the output is concerned..... can anyone point me into the thread direction?? I was interupted and timed out on my server connection.
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#50
:topic:I know that this is not related to this partiqular thread, however, I started reading a thread about having 1 manual for 2 branches of a company , even though the 2 have nothing in common as far as the output is concerned..... can anyone point me into the thread direction?? I was interupted and timed out on my server connection.
Is this the thread you're looking for?
 
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