ISO Training Providers to fix careless workers?

[Sidney Vianna]

Speak to the employees in plain, clear language Earn their respect and you will get buy-in.

I second that as well, but I have to say that, in my career as an auditor, the glaring cases of employees carelessness for quality/workmanship/engagement were in unionized shops. Some of the interviews I had with unionized workers were surreal.

 

[Jen Kirley]

I completely agree that disciplinary actions aren't called for here. We can also feel sure that if the people don't care about the quality of what they produce they won't care at all about what ISO says. Why would they?

The standard lost a lot of shalls in 2015, but management responsibility grew exponentially. I support their Gemba walks (I agree to not call it that) but there needs to be more. I wonder if there has been a collapse of trust in management. I wonder if people have decided no one cares what they think, so when managers finally do show up the people will snap shut like clams.

There is a lot of work to do here. People need to be asked - by someone they trust - what would help them improve their work lives. I have been able to gain people's trust in this way, but I have to caution you it took a long time of my being there, connecting with them, consistently supporting what they were experiencing, doing what I could to help. In one employer I could materially do very little. In another employer, years later, I had more power (full time internal auditor) to help correct things.

I can only imagine how much this is costing. If quality of outputs improved, would these people receive some of the benefits via some type of profit sharing/incentive program? I know we shouldn't have to do this, but in times like these it might help to motivate at least some of them - and that could maybe start a trend. I say maybe because there could be unintended consequences in some people benefiting from other people's efforts.

My heart is with you. This is very difficult. My fellow Covers are likely tired of my posting this, but the Texas Nameplate story comes to mind with questions like yours.

 

[Steve Prevette]

From what I am hearing, you may want to look at "Turn the Ship Around" by David Marquet

An introductory (and humourous) video is here ->MindSpring Presents: "Greatness" by David Marquet - YouTube

 

[Jen Kirley]

Steve, that's brilliant! And both of those leaders described it as personally hard for them to do. But for both it was very rewarding.

 

[John Predmore]

"Turn the Ship Around" by David Marquet

I was reminded of another great leadership book by a naval officer "It's Your Ship" by D. Michael Abrashoff.

 

[Bev D]

I too was in a similar situation. Non-union. shift work. Management rarely got on 3rd shift to connect with those doing the work. While some in management knew they needed to fix their problem enough of those in management were “discipline ‘em and terminate ‘em until they comply with the rules” types. This went all the way down to the front line supervisors because that’s how you got promoted. Act and behave like your manager and you get rewarded. These same managers also used the anti-patience leverage to continually say - see this won’t work. It takes TIME to turn the ship and the culture around. Many in management won’t get on board (It’s the old “dance with who brung you” & old habits die hard concept) and they are the ones that need to change or leave. I guarantee that if you discipline the operators you will fail. If you work on changing management and focusing on improving the work you will succeed.

 

[Steve Prevette]

Thanks, Bev. I too was in a similar situation on my initial hiring as a maintenance supervisor at the Hanford DOE site. I was part of a mass hiring to replace line management (we found that out after being hired) and our employer had told the government we would be evaluated for management skills by a 3rd party. Fortunately I was diverted off to metrics prior to the eval. I went to it and was presented a stack of scenarios. One was a worker who was not making quota. In the role play I was trying to elicit what was the issue, was the quota realistic - and it became obvious they wanted me to move on to the discipline. The scenario I did last (by my choice) was an employee who missed their Total Quality training! I told them to the effect of I would have skipped it too given the previous "answers" they were looking for.

Fortunately since I was not going to be a manager, it had no effect.

 

[Mike S.]

I second that as well, but I have to say that, in my career as an auditor, the glaring cases of employees carelessness for quality/workmanship/engagement were in unionized shops. Some of the interviews I had with unionized workers were surreal.

Yes, union workplaces can be a special kind of situation. But it is a cultural/leadership problem, nevertheless.

I have a close relative who works in a union workplace (construction). He is a go-getter who takes pride in his work. In some cases, he still finds himself on a hire list behind people well known as lazy/poor workers, but occasionally contractors will hire him on as a foreman for extra $ just so they can skip over the deadwood and get him on their site. And he is usually last to be laid-off as a site winds down. Some of the stories he tells of lazy workers are sad, especially considering they are being very well paid.

 

[John Broomfield]

Good leaders understand that they have a duty to help employees to do good work.

System specialists may advise them and show how to develop the organization so it works as an effective system to fulfill its purpose.

This may include a style of leadership known as servant leadership.

 

[Ed Panek]

You can't "Inspect In" Quality.