Filip M.

Involved In Discussions
#1
Hi, which direction will IATF taken with the ISO/TS 16949 after the roll out of the new ISO 9001:2015 ? What is the strategy of the IATF concerning the revision of ISO 9001 ? Heard somewhere IATF has send a waiver to ISO that they not will following the new ISO 9001:2015. What are here the consequences for those organizations that are ISO/TS certified ? Remark: the body of ISO/TS is based on ISO 9001:2008.
Like to hear your comments.
BR, Filip
 

Kales Veggie

People: The Vital Few
#2
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Hi, Filip:

The IATF has no choice. They have to update ISO/TS for exactly the reason you mentioned. After the 2015 release, 2008 becomes obsolete.

Last time it took the IATF one year to update ISO/TS 16949.
 

Filip M.

Involved In Discussions
#3
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Hi, thx. for the reply Kales. But the IATF has submitted a letter of waiver regarding annexSL and the High level structure for any future revision of ISO/TS 16949. It was submitted pursuant to the ISO Technical Management Board (TMB) and it was presented at the ISO TMB in June 2012
 

Jeff Frost

Inactive Registered Visitor
#4
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Just attending a presentation by DNV and have also heard from other sources that it is not a sure thing the automotive will adopt ISO 9001:2015. 2015 is more process based and less descriptive than 2008 which is an issue.
 

Raffy

Quite Involved in Discussions
#5
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future?

Said adoption may create multitude issues to other industry that do not belong to automotive, i.e. Health Care Organizations.:mg:
Raffy:cool:
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#6
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Just attending a presentation by DNV and have also heard from other sources that it is not a sure thing the automotive will adopt ISO 9001:2015. 2015 is more process based and less descriptive than 2008 which is an issue.
I think I attended the same presentation, Jeff...:D

The issue is: In any supply chain, customers see suppliers as assets and liabilities. Customers want to boost confidence in its supply chain ability to perform on-quality, on-time and on-cost. In some of the highly regulated supply chains, such as aerospace, automotive, medical devices, chemical, oil & gas, etc..we have, traditionally, attempted to ensure supplier performance via a "strict" command-and-control approach, with "clear, implementable and auditable" REQUIREMENTS.

In some (influential) people's minds, the direction of the future ISO 9001 document is reducing the "command-and-control" aspect for hardware manufacturers, in order to make the document more universally adaptable, i.e., service, small, non-traditional organizations....So, these (influential) people are concerned that ISO 9001 is being "watered down" to improve it's market penetration, but, as an unintended consequence, it might make it more difficult to keep suppliers accountable to customer requirements.

Without a doubt, future versions of TS16949, AS9100, TL-9000, etc. could still use ISO 9001:2015 as a baseline and have industry-specific quality system requirements added on to the document, but if these documents end up being of difficult auditability, some industry sectors might not see the benefit of keeping it's industry QMS standard aligned with ISO 9001.

Time will tell.
 

Jeff Frost

Inactive Registered Visitor
#7
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Now that you mention it Sidney, I did see you there and though the DNV representative did excellent job of presenting ISO 9001:2015 information… :)

I have been reading through Committee Draft (CD) copy of 2015 and some of the concerns I have relate to how much additional information the 91XX and 16949 ICOP groups will need to fold back into their version of the standard to make it a useful? Could we be heading back to the pre 91XX and 16949 days when each OEM created supplemental quality requirements to address their industries/companies "command-and-control" needs? I hope not.
 

artorius22

Starting to get Involved
#8
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Jeff,

A lot of the sub tiers already have done so - American Axle has their own system as well as Dana.
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#9
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Could we be heading back to the pre 91XX and 16949 days when each OEM created supplemental quality requirements to address their industries/companies "command-and-control" needs? I hope not.
Jeff, not sure what you mean. Most large automotive and aerospace OEM's (and Tier 1 suppliers) have always had their CSR's (customer specific requirements). So, that has not changed, and I doubt if it will change, irrespective of the ISO 9001:2015, AS9100:2016 and ISO/TS 16949:201X directions...
 

Jeff Frost

Inactive Registered Visitor
#10
Re: Will ISO/TS16949 be aligned to ISO9001:2015 in the future ?

Sidney, I was thinking about the good old day when there was only ISO 9001, 9002, and 9003. Boeing developed their own quality system known as D1-9000 and of course McDonnell Douglas had their equivalent. Ha the joy of having to rewrite your quality system procedures based on who was auditing you that week. Of course it is true most large automotive and aerospace OEM's do have their additional requirements but having to meet a specific home grown systems like D1-9000 for each OEM was, and could be again, a big pain.
 

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