Jishuken - Anybody familiar with this term?

[Craig H.]

Re: Jishekan - Anybody familiar with this term?

Great post, Wes, and it goes to what I have been thinking in my gut (we don't want to go there, please) for some time now. Some are looking for "instant pudding". But...

Those that are kinda, sort of, familiar with a process, the inputs, outputs, and such, may have a view that can result in process improvements. Dumping the clueless into a manufacturing situation that they are not used to is not smart.

Those nutty folks where I work send me out to audit situations that I am not all that comfortable with, and sometimes I find areas where employees could work together in a fashion that is better than what they are currently using. I say nutty, but I am going to work in the morning, while getting a nice paycheck...

I am lucky that I am able to do this.

So, sending in the clueless does not make sense. Sending in the kinda clued may be smart.

Again, your milage may vary.

 

[wmarhel]

Re: Jishekan - Anybody familiar with this term?

Hi,

This is used at Toyota and was first introduced by Taiichi Ohno to get his managers to understand their suppliers and customers. It is a high level kaizen group going to an area they know nothing about and sharing their observations. Theory being: they would give some good information from fresh minds and eyes, while at the same time learning something about what they were looking at.

I wondered if anyone has used it?

Paul

Jishuken was essentially the "Autonomous Study Groups" utilized by Taiichi Ohno in the beginning of the development of TPS. At that time, it was required that managers get out on the production floor to do hands-on activities. This was the forefather of the "kaizen events" so many do today.

Wayne

 

[wmarhel]

Re: Jishekan - Anybody familiar with this term?

The situation, according to Akio, is the "ignorant" kaizen team comes in, and their flurry of activity is interpreted (by them) as doing something good, but subsequent events show changes suggested and initiated did not deliver the expected result because the kaizen team didn't have enough knowledge about a process or a system, but were duty bound to come up with something, anything different to demonstrate they were "working." Despite lip service to the contrary, FEAR still rules the worker in Japan.

Here are some of Akio's comments over the past year:

“Kaizen” is the way many immature companies have been doing in Japan these decades.

Hi Wes,

Something everyone should consider though, is that this is based on the opinion of Akio. While there are certainly companies out there who either misunderstand or misapply this and other concepts; it doesn't mean that companies aren't employing it effectively.

Based on some of Akio's past comments on the ASQ board towards simple questions related to kaizen/Lean/TPS, it is almost as if he has an axe to grind with somebody.

Wayne

 

[Stijloor]

Fellow Covers,

I learned a few things today.....

Jishuken. Scroll down on the page for the article.

Stijloor.

 

[Wes Bucey]

Re: Jishekan - Anybody familiar with this term?

Hi Wes,

Something everyone should consider though, is that this is based on the opinion of Akio. While there are certainly companies out there who either misunderstand or misapply this and other concepts; it doesn't mean that companies aren't employing it effectively.

Based on some of Akio's past comments on the ASQ board towards simple questions related to kaizen/Lean/TPS, it is almost as if he has an axe to grind with somebody.

Wayne

Make no mistake. Akio is a curmudgeonly guy even older than I am. Even so, he can still hit an 85 mph fastball (from a fast pitch machine) often enough to shame most college baseball players.

I guess he DOES have an axe to grind - as many of us do who are frustrated by continually seeing top managers jump from "flavor of the month" to "flavor of the month" without any basic concept of System of Profound Knowledge, employee empowerment, customer-centricity, or any of other concepts which can go toward making an organization more efficient and profitable.

Whether we call it "waste" or "muda," the result is the same - less efficiency, less profit, and less pie to split between bosses and workers and investors.

Especially you, Wayne, will recall the embarrassment folks in the Lean Division felt when we had the tiresome woman try to monopolize the Lean Forum at ASQ Forums, spouting Japanese phrases as if she were the first and only one to introduce the concept of efficiency in an industrial setting. Thankfully, she has retired from the arena, leaving Lean experts like you to answer newbie quesions factually and articulately.

I still think the worst thing we ever did was to change our Division name from "Advanced Manufacturing Interest Group" and adopt the buzzword, LEAN, when we achieved official Division status.

As to the major thrust of your response - that "some" organizations are effectively deploying Lean concepts - absolutely! The situation is that they also do not have a bunch of know-nothings initiating change for the sake of change - they are focused and efficient in looking for improvement opportunities and have well-established protocols for evaluating the relative value of such changes BEFORE they throw out the old methods.

 

[prototyper]

When used properly Kaizen techniques can be amazing tools, but they have to be used in the right context.

Too often management pick up on the latest flavour of the month quality tools because they are taken in by the buzzwords and think they can apply it throughout the organisation, with a scattergun approach, expecting the results to be fantastic. When the plan fails through poor implementation it is swept under the carpet and everyone moves on to the next flavour of the month.

If these tools are used in a targeted and structured way, however, the results can be much different. Train the team properly, select an area of operation with a history of problems (quality or production issues), follow the methodology strictly and sustainable improvements will result.

As for leaving a process in a worse condition, this should never happen as the first thing to do is to accurately measure the current process. If any changes result in a worse condition then you revert back to the original process! Management must be made aware that change should not be made for the sake of change and it should be backed up with measurement.

I was trained in Kaizen techniques by Nissan in the early 1990's and the first activity I was involved with resulted in savings of £265,000pa and a 40% improvement in throughput from a small manufacturing cell.

I know it works! I have seen the results first hand, but as with all tools it must be used properly.

 

[wmarhel]

Re: Jishekan - Anybody familiar with this term?

I guess he DOES have an axe to grind - as many of us do who are frustrated by continually seeing top managers jump from "flavor of the month" to "flavor of the month" without any basic concept of System of Profound Knowledge, employee empowerment, customer-centricity, or any of other concepts which can go toward making an organization more efficient and profitable.

Wes, I'm sure he's a really swell guy. The really sad part though is that a lot of his message get's lost in the tone. Maybe if he were a little more yoda-like in his approach he could influence more people to a better way of thinking.

I still think the worst thing we ever did was to change our Division name from "Advanced Manufacturing Interest Group" and adopt the buzzword, LEAN, when we achieved official Division status.

No disagreement there. I'm still surprised ASQ as an organization hasn't adopted some new moniker/tagline to encompass all the buzzwords and areas of focus.

As to the major thrust of your response - that "some" organizations are effectively deploying Lean concepts - absolutely! The situation is that they also do not have a bunch of know-nothings initiating change for the sake of change - they are focused and efficient in looking for improvement opportunities and have well-established protocols for evaluating the relative value of such changes BEFORE they throw out the old methods.

Agreed. The gist of commentary though was that the messenger shouldn't be killed because he was trained poorly. I get frustrated at times too with some of the nonsense, but I also don't want to turn anybody off either.

I also don't claim to be an expert. Maybe just a little more well read than others, or I've had some exposure that they haven't. It's a constant game of learning, and forums like this help to keep the grey matter between the ears alive. I always take the perspective that if a person doesn't understand afterwards; either I didn't know the material well enough to explain it, or I just didn't present it in the best manner for them.

Wayne

 

[Icy Mountain]

Re: Jishekan - Anybody familiar with this term?

Sending in the kinda clued may be smart.

I would consider myself "kinda" clued.

At that time, it was required that managers get out on the production floor to do hands-on activities.

And that is never a bad thing in my book. Way too many "managers" have no idea what the people they are managing actually do for eight hours every day.

I'm still surprised ASQ as an organization hasn't adopted some new moniker/tagline to encompass all the buzzwords and areas of focus.

I thought that's what "six sigma" was.

 

[wmarhel]

Re: Jishekan - Anybody familiar with this term?

I thought that's what "six sigma" was.

Would that ASQ transformation be something along the lines of:

American Six Sigma Society​

That in turn would create a possibility for a new logo as well: :ca:

Wayne

 

[Icy Mountain]

Well, I wasn't going to go that far down the road but since I've got a traveling companion. I passed the CQE test, too. About 15 years ago. I could go get a bunch of ASQ letters after my name, too. Big whoop.

Tell me you managed to get your whole company certified. Show me your scrap and rework rates. Show me you are trying some different ways to get your passengers engaged in driving the bus. Now I'm impressed. This black belt? J.C. Penny, $2.99.