Keeping an External Auditor on because he's "useless"...

[Brian Hunt]

The 'tame auditor' strategy is one that I've come across - again with BSI. This was going back about ten years, but the guy was getting paid about $1000/day for the three day audit (a nice little earner as we Brits say) - it was very easy for me to manage the audit and get a good report even though I knew that there were big holes in the management systems.

When I took over as quality manager of another company that was committed to quality. one of the first things I did was to change our external auditors from BSI to LRQA - I auditioned three ICRA accredited bodies and LRQA were the best. They understood the business and would work with me to highlight the areas that I wanted to be improved but were anything but tame - which made them very effective.

BSI get a bad press for their auditors - but one of the best BSI auditors I ever dealt with was an ex BT engineer turned auditor and he was excellent. You can always shop around and find an auditor who is a better fit to your company.

 

[JaneB]

I auditioned three ICRA accredited bodies and LRQA were the best. They understood the business and would work with me to highlight the areas that I wanted to be improved but were anything but tame - which made them very effective.

Yes, that's been my experience of them also.

You can always shop around and find an auditor who is a better fit to your company.

I agree. I've met excellent auditors from various companies. And most times, it is a matter of finding the right 'fit'. If one supplier doesn't fit, find another who's better.

 

[Mike S.]

Hello,

The company is market leading manufacturer and supplier.

The company has ISO:9001 accreditation for a small part of the business only (most customers don't realise this and that suits the business!) and recently had its six-monthly visit from BSI.

Some of the lies told to this auditor are beyond belief. Our Quality System is an outdated and unrefered to group of documents which the HSQE manager boots up twice a year to make the odd change prior to audit.

At the following Quality Management Review meeting - always held after audits - (not attendend by any directors for the second time running) the HSQE manager and various supply chain managers spent the majority of the time laughing about how they have got through yet another audit.


Phil

Here's my take: Nothing significant will change unless/until the Top Dog decides it will change. There is little a person in your position can do except try for small gains at the level you have direct influence and authority over, if any. Do what you can, but when higher-ups push back, back down. Document everything as a CYA initiative. Don't do anything illegal -- don't go to jail for anyone.

In the interim do your best to learn as much as you can and keep your resume' up-to-date and be looking every day to get our on your own terms, not theirs. Try to go to work for a company that wants to actually improve.

I have been in your shoes. Best of luck!

 

[Sandra Gauvin]

The success of any program/initiative (Quality System, Six Sigma, etc.) is dependent on the commitment of upper management. As Mike said, you're not going to change the mindset of management. Update your resume and continue looking for opportunities at companies that embrace Quality. Make sure during the interview process that you ask questions that would indicate the actual Quality culture and not the perceived culture.

 

[Sidney Vianna]

Make sure during the interview process that you ask questions that would indicate the actual Quality culture and not the perceived culture.

That is a very good advice. Many people forget that, when interviewing for a job, it gives them, the applicant, a good chance to gain insight about the organization culture. People try too hard to be perceived as the right candidate and forget to ask probing questions about their potential future employer.

The success of any program/initiative (Quality System, Six Sigma, etc.) is dependent on the commitment of upper management.

A major red flag. If a Quality System is perceived as a "program" or "initiative", it is a major indication of an organization's ignorance and possible lack of compatibility with meaningful quality deployment. If Quality is not an integral part of the business system, hard coded in the organization's culture, it is a major red flag, IMHO.

 

[Bifften]

Just to say thanks for all the advice contained within. I've read it all, thank you.