Management Review Meetings - Auditor issued an Area of Concern regarding our method

[Randy]

Re: Management Review Meetings

I have a matter of concern with your auditor who is providing evidence of not being competent in the field of auditing and with ISO 9001:2008

1. There is no requirement for any kind of meeting

2. There is no requirement for an annual anything

You do anything you want, any way you want that is effective for you, just cover the required inputs, develop the required outputs, take any necessary actions and keep a record of it all.....Then tell the auditor to either stand up to release the pressure on his neck or leave.

 

[AndyN]

Re: Management Review Meetings - Auditor issued an Area of Concern regarding our meth

We have set up a system where we review all inputs as required in ISO9001:2008 5.6.2. at a weekly Management Review Meeting. The agenda rolls on a five week cycle, so all inputs are review a minimum of every five weeks. Any outputs assigned out of this the to specific managers is then reviewed at a monthly Projects Meeting. Seems to me like we are meeting the requirements. However, in our recent re-registration audit the Auditor issued an Area of Concern regarding our method. He stated that the standard requires that we have at least one meeting a year that reviews all of the 5.6.2. inputs. Comments?

Yup - ask his/her management not to send them again.........that's clearly bogus comment!

 

[JaneB]

Re: Management Review Meetings

I asked the Auditor to show me where in the standard it was stated that we must have one meeting that reviews all inputs for Management Review in one meeting. He backed off a bit and mumbled something about how it was the philosophy of the Registrar he is employed by to require clients to have one meeting that reviews all at the same time.

Yeah, right - wonder if his technical manager would say the same thing? I'd ask and find out.

As Randy says, there are some definite areas of concern over this auditor!

 

[brahmaiah]

Re: Management Review Meetings - Auditor issued an Area of Concern regarding our meth

We have set up a system where we review all inputs as required in ISO9001:2008 5.6.2. at a weekly Management Review Meeting. The agenda rolls on a five week cycle, so all inputs are review a minimum of every five weeks. Any outputs assigned out of this the to specific managers is then reviewed at a monthly Projects Meeting. Seems to me like we are meeting the requirements. However, in our recent re-registration audit the Auditor issued an Area of Concern regarding our method. He stated that the standard requires that we have at least one meeting a year that reviews all of the 5.6.2. inputs. Comments?

Before I give my opinion on your query I need following information:
a)Your Quality manual statement against clause no.5.6.2
b)List of persons who have attended all MRM meetings& their designations
c)Your agenda for MRMS.
It is unfair to comment on the auditor without knowing the full details.
V.J.Brahmaiah

 

[brahmaiah]

Re: Management Review Meetings

I have a matter of concern with your auditor who is providing evidence of not being competent in the field of auditing and with ISO 9001:2008

1. There is no requirement for any kind of meeting

2. There is no requirement for an annual anything

You do anything you want, any way you want that is effective for you, just cover the required inputs, develop the required outputs, take any necessary actions and keep a record of it all.....Then tell the auditor to either stand up to release the pressure on his neck or leave.

What if the meetings were not attended by the top management.Can you call the meetings MRMS?.How can the top management find time to attend a weekly MRM.Daily,WEEKLY,meetings where the top management is absent are not MRMS.Attendence of the CEO OR MD is necessary in an MRM.Lower level officers cannot represent top management unless they entrusted with all the executive powers.Mear letter of authority is not enough.
V.J.Brahmaiah

 

[Big Jim]

Re: Management Review Meetings

I have a matter of concern with your auditor who is providing evidence of not being competent in the field of auditing and with ISO 9001:2008

1. There is no requirement for any kind of meeting

2. There is no requirement for an annual anything

3. There is no requirement for a written procedure for management review

You do anything you want, any way you want that is effective for you, just cover the required inputs, develop the required outputs, take any necessary actions and keep a record of it all.....Then tell the auditor to either stand up to release the pressure on his neck or leave.

Correction made

 

[Tony C]

Re: Management Review Meetings

What if the meetings were not attended by the top management.Can you call the meetings MRMS?.How can the top management find time to attend a weekly MRM.Daily,WEEKLY,meetings where the top management is absent are not MRMS.Attendence of the CEO OR MD is necessary in an MRM.Lower level officers cannot represent top management unless they entrusted with all the executive powers.Mear letter of authority is not enough.
V.J.Brahmaiah

The area of concern was that all management review inputs were not covered in one meeting, nothing to do with attendance of senior management.

The standard does not prescribe how you should carry out management reviews merely the areas for input and output and that they are documented.

If I was auditing I would be pleased to see management reviews carried out regularly and providing all areas are covered as described on a rotating basis see this as a sensible approach.

Regards,

Tony

 

[brahmaiah]

Re: Management Review Meetings

The area of concern was that all management review inputs were not covered in one meeting, nothing to do with attendance of senior management.

The standard does not prescribe how you should carry out management reviews merely the areas for input and output and that they are documented.

If I was auditing I would be pleased to see management reviews carried out regularly and providing all areas are covered as described on a rotating basis see this as a sensible approach.

Regards,

Tony

I have asked for some vital information about the conduct of the meetings. I will give my opinion after getting full information.
V.J.Brahmaiah

 

[howste]

Re: Management Review Meetings

I have a matter of concern with your auditor who is providing evidence of not being competent in the field of auditing and with ISO 9001:2008

1. There is no requirement for any kind of meeting

2. There is no requirement for an annual anything

3. There is NO requirement for a written procedure for management review

You do anything you want, any way you want that is effective for you, just cover the required inputs, develop the required outputs, take any necessary actions and keep a record of it all.....Then tell the auditor to either stand up to release the pressure on his neck or leave.

Correction made

Correction to your correction made.

 

[qcman012856]

Re: Management Review Meetings - Auditor issued an Area of Concern regarding our meth

Response to brahaiah's request for additional data:
Quality Manual
5.6. Management Review

5.6.1 General

The top management shall review the Quality Management System during regularly scheduled staff and projects meetings. This review identifies trends and adjusts policy and business plans as necessary. This review shall review the suitability of the Quality Management System, quality policy, quality objectives, changing business needs, customer satisfaction, operational and performance results, quality trends, continual improvement, assessment of resources, results of quality audits, and corrective and preventive action activities.

Records of the quality systems reviews shall be maintained.

5.6.2 Review Input

The input to the management review shall include information on:
• Audit results. (internal and external)
• Feedback from customers.
• Process performance and product conformity.
• Follow-up action from previous management reviews.
• Changes that could affect the Quality System.
• Improvement recommendations.

5.6.3. Review Output

Output from the management review shall include any decisions and actions related to:
• Improvement of the effectiveness of the Quality Management System and it’s supporting processes.
• Improvement of product performance related to customer and internal requirements.
• Resource needs.

2. All managers including the owner attend every meeting.
3. Rolling Agenda listed below...
Weekly Staff Meeting
Management Review Follow-up Schedule
September, 2009

1st Monday of Month (09/07/2009)
• Labor Day - OFF

Wednesday 9/9/2009 – 9:00 a.m.
Project Review Meeting

2nd Monday of Month (09/14/2009)
 CAR/PAR Status
o Internal Audit
o Review schedule prioritize as necessary
 RMA and Test/Repair
 On Time Delivery
 Monthly Inventory $ Breakdown

3rd Monday of Month (09/21/2009)
 Flexible Workforce (Training)– All Managers
 Quality Data Feedback to Shop Floor

4th Monday of Month (09/28/2009)
 RMA and Test/Repair
 On Time Delivery
 RONA Discussion
 Changes to QMS
o Training opportunities as a result of changes
o Impact to overall business
o Review and approve changes