Moving and positioning of patient - Mechanical hazard

Marcelo

Inactive Registered Visitor
#11
An example of a common energy-related hazard framework is the one from Product Safety Management and Engineering from Willie Hammer.

Hazard framework.png
 
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Marcelo

Inactive Registered Visitor
#12
I understand. Then Table 19 in Chapter 9 is not correct when listing "crushing hazard" and others, since the actual hazards are the subclauses associated with them like Trapping zone and overtravel, et cetera.
Nope, the crushing hazard is correct. What is not correct, as I mentioned before, is the "patient moving hazard", it does not make any sense.
 
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Ronen E

Problem Solver
Staff member
Moderator
#13
In this particular example, the patient is exposed to being crushed, so the hazard is a crushing hazard, which is related to the possible harm. The fact that the patient moved or was moved is not related to the harm.
I think that this is a little backwards. Saying that there is a "crushing hazard" is like saying (in another context) that there is a "death hazard", which is wrong. Crushing, or patient crush, or getting crushed, is a harm. "A crushing hazard" is just a non-insightful / non-specific way of relating to several different hazards that could lead to the crushing harm. For example, a patient may be crushed because the device moved them against something, or because a heavy device installed above the patient (and not intended to move the patient) dislodged and fell on them. These are two different hazards that lead to a similar harm through different hazardous situations. The risks associated may be different and so may be the mitigation means.

In my example, the fact that the patient was moved is related to the harm, because that harm wouldn't have come about (through this particular scenario) if the patient wasn't being moved. There would still be a potential for harm (a hazard and a risk), but there would not be actual harm. This is where probabilities come into play.
 

Ronen E

Problem Solver
Staff member
Moderator
#14
An example of a common energy-related hazard framework is the one from Product Safety Management and Engineering from Willie Hammer.

View attachment 25908
To me this is simply a risks "shopping list" that may promote completeness (not a bad thing in any way). I don't see how it's specifically related to energy types - leakage, toxic hazards and "miscellaneous" have little to do with energy.
 

Marcelo

Inactive Registered Visitor
#15
Crushing is not a harm, harm is what happens to the patient (laceration, or something like that). As I mentioned several times, you can write anything you want in a blank page, but it does not mean that it's correct.
 

Marcelo

Inactive Registered Visitor
#16
To me this is simply a risks "shopping list" that may promote completeness (not a bad thing in any way). I don't see how it's specifically related to energy types - leakage, toxic hazards and "miscellaneous" have little to do with energy.
It's based on the energy transfer causality model for harm, which is the usual historical one.
 

Ronen E

Problem Solver
Staff member
Moderator
#17
Crushing is not a harm, harm is what happens to the patient (laceration, or something like that).
This is becoming a linguistic argument. I think that being in a crushed state is a harm, and in my previous post I hinted that the exact phrasing can be altered but all phrasings relate to the same thing. Using other words to graphically describe how a person feels or looks when they are crushed doesn't add real value to the risk management. Harm is the undesirable end state. The hazardous situation is the combination or scenario that can bring about this end state. The hazard is the aspect that makes such combination or scenario possible / relevant.

you can write anything you want in a blank page, but it does not mean that it's correct.
This is a general statement that applies to all of us.
 

AbelVV

Starting to get Involved
#18
Thank you both for the insight! It seems as though it's not black and white. In the end, hopefully we can reduce the hazardous situations and that's the whole point of RM.

Mr. Antunes, could you please point me somewhere I could read a bit more into "energy transfer causality model for harm"? It sounds really interesting.

Thank you again,
Abel
 

Marcelo

Inactive Registered Visitor
#19
Mr. Antunes, could you please point me somewhere I could read a bit more into "energy transfer causality model for harm"? It sounds really interesting.
Sure, here is a link with a good overview of causality models: Models of Causation: Safety (I usually use this document and some others as basis for my risk management trainings).

Please note that ISO 14971 does not require that you define a causality model, but you have to define one to do a proper risk management.
 
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