MSA (Measurement System Analysis) Competency Test

[tammydiz]

Okay...first let me state that I am a quality systems person...not by any means a master in MSA (basic knowledge only!). I have been tasked to develop a written competency exam for CMM and calibration lab group based on the MSA manual. :mg: I will provide them all a copy of the AIAG manual to study with and then administer a test to ensure they understand the general principles of MSA. Now, to their credit they have all been working in the CMM lab or performing calibrations for quite some time (~5 years), so they should already have some basic knowledge. My question - does anyone already have an exam for MSA so I don't have to go through the entire manual? :

 

[Bev D]

Why do they need an exam?

 

[tammydiz]

Because my boss wants them to have one! I suppose he wants to know that they are up to date on the requirements of the MSA manual that we are issuing to them....

 

[dgriffith]

Writing tests is both science and art. Your company should decide if they want the employees to demonstrate test-taking ability, or demonstrate they know the answer to the questions that are relevant to your/their operations. So, they should be either tricky and ambiguous, or clear and to the point.
At the lower skill levels, questions should come from obvious text, usually in the first few lines of a paragraph or a chart that's plainly seen, etc. Higher skill levels are expected to have a deeper understanding and many questions will come from near the ends of a paragraph where esoterica and minutia of detail can be found.

I assume there will be math, statistics and certainly an oral defense of their MSA honors thesis to a committe of three or more. . . .

 

[DRAMMAN]

This sounds like the type of **** that would come from bosses who know nothing about the skill set the are trying to develop.

1. Just because someone does calibrations or can run a CMM it does not mean they know anything about MSA.

2. Doing an "MSA" is not a normal step in a calibration process.

3. Have these people who are about to be tested ever been trained in MSA? Do they currently perform MSA's on a regular basis?

4. Is there an in-house MSA expert?

 

[Bev D]

you are in a difficult position. sometimes our bosses ask for the wrong solution to a real problem. worse is when they ask for the wrong solution to an imaginary problem. I'm not sure what type of boss you have but my recommendation would be to ask him what problem he is trying to solve with a MSA test. This will help with designing a 'useful' assessment or forgoing the assessment all together adn focusing on hands on training and practical examples. The red flag for me is expecting these poor people to 'study teh manual' and then take a test that someone who knows very little about this complex topic has written. It ahs almost no chance of accomplishing anything positive. It has every chance of jsut p!$$!#g off the people doing the work. (excuse my english)

Are these people not doing MSAs but you are providing them with an expensive manual? are they not doing them correctly? are they providing incorrect advice based on incorrect interpretation? are sytems failing the MSAs, slowing things down and the boss doesn't like the slowdown? Have you failed a customer audit for improper or incorrect MSAs? Do you have a calibration problem or a repeatability or reproducibility problem?

As second question I have is: what kind of measurement systems will they be assessing? since you mention CMM are they only looking at continuous data measurements of static characteristics (features adn dimensions) or will they also be assessing properties (hardness, tensile strength, surface finish etc.). Will they be assessing functional properties, categorical defects (vision system, x-ray, human visual)...

 

[tammydiz]

I assume there will be math, statistics and certainly an oral defense of their MSA honors thesis to a committe of three or more. . . .

Not so much ...the test, as I'm told to create, is only to be questions straight from the manual. There are core tool classes offered that have a test of some kind to determine if the material has been absorbed and somewhat understood. I would like to do something like that. If my boss wants a test - then a test he shall receive. I may not like it or even approve of it, but that's what he wants.

 

[tammydiz]

This sounds like the type of **** that would come from bosses who know nothing about the skill set the are trying to develop.

1. Just because someone does calibrations or can run a CMM it does not mean they know anything about MSA.

2. Doing an "MSA" is not a normal step in a calibration process.

3. Have these people who are about to be tested ever been trained in MSA? Do they currently perform MSA's on a regular basis?

4. Is there an in-house MSA expert?

Yes, that would be my kind of boss, so with that in mind I hope you don't mind my humor...
1. You would be correct, which is why they now get a manual without training so they can figure it out on their own as they usually do.
2. :mg:
3. Refer to #1
4. An in house what???

 

[tammydiz]

you are in a difficult position. sometimes our bosses ask for the wrong solution to a real problem. worse is when they ask for the wrong solution to an imaginary problem. I'm not sure what type of boss you have but my recommendation would be to ask him what problem he is trying to solve with a MSA test. This will help with designing a 'useful' assessment or forgoing the assessment all together adn focusing on hands on training and practical examples. The red flag for me is expecting these poor people to 'study teh manual' and then take a test that someone who knows very little about this complex topic has written. It ahs almost no chance of accomplishing anything positive. It has every chance of jsut p!$$!#g off the people doing the work. (excuse my english)

Are these people not doing MSAs but you are providing them with an expensive manual? are they not doing them correctly? are they providing incorrect advice based on incorrect interpretation? are sytems failing the MSAs, slowing things down and the boss doesn't like the slowdown? Have you failed a customer audit for improper or incorrect MSAs? Do you have a calibration problem or a repeatability or reproducibility problem?

As second question I have is: what kind of measurement systems will they be assessing? since you mention CMM are they only looking at continuous data measurements of static characteristics (features adn dimensions) or will they also be assessing properties (hardness, tensile strength, surface finish etc.). Will they be assessing functional properties, categorical defects (vision system, x-ray, human visual)...

Yes, the poor people will be handed the manual and be left on their own from there to study and absorb material that they may have never seen before.

We have not failed a customer audit yet :, however the data coming out of our Measuring Lab is not reliable, nor are our fixtures or measurement systems, for that matter I can't even guarantee that the data they are measuring to is even correct as some CAD data has not been updated and some fixtures are 3 engineering levels behind. Yes, to say the least, we have some issues. These issues are currently being addressed. Did I mention I have been here for less than 1 year??!!

Different parts of the lab measure different things, CMM takes dimensional data, testing takes properties for hardness, surface, etc., calibration of course calibrates fixtures and measuring equipment.

 

[DRAMMAN]

As Bev asked, what is driving the desire to have a test? Is there a specific problem the boss is hoping a test will cure?