Must we identify steps taken to identify the Root Cause of a failure

insect warfare

QA=Question Authority
Trusted Information Resource
#11
Hallo,

Hopefully this is just a quick question.

When we record the RCA do we need to be saying the steps taken to identify the RCA or is it sufficient to just say what the root cause is?
My understanding was that you need to say how you got to the root cause because there could be other causes besides the one that they identified (but how do you know that if you didn't look at what they did to identify the cause?). I could be asking too much of the staff though if all they need is to say what they identified the root cause to be.

Before asking them to complete it I just wanted to make sure I'm not asking them what isn't called for!

Thanks,
Avril
I agree with Mikishots. Someone - somewhere down the line - will eventually probe this process and ask how you arrived at your conclusions. Our customers usually request this information more than anyone.

A good rule of thumb for me is to be able to look upon one of these records a year down the road and know exactly how we determined what the true problems were, because most of the time, if you don't record this critical step of the process, then its information will essentially decay into tribal knowledge - sometimes that includes important information which could come in very handy later, and you would be smacking yourself on the forehead for not jotting it down beforehand.

While my company does not use a sector-specific format like 8D, we do use a CA form tailored to our specific needs. It includes fields for containment actions, root cause(s), and failure analysis....for us, this field outlines exactly how we reached our root cause determinations. To me, it is the best insurance policy for backing up a root cause justification, so why not use it to your advantage? It just makes good business sense - no matter what field you're in.

Brian :rolleyes:
 
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A

arunnivas

#12
If required, brainstorming session can be conducted within the company to identify the root cause. Moreover, minute can be maintained for this session to justify your rootcause.

- Arun Nivas
 
C

CATERAF

#13
While my company does not use a sector-specific format like 8D, we do use a CA form tailored to our specific needs. It includes fields for containment actions, root cause(s), and failure analysis....for us, this field outlines exactly how we reached our root cause determinations. To me, it is the best insurance policy for backing up a root cause justification, so why not use it to your advantage? It just makes good business sense - no matter what field you're in.
Yes, we do have a detailed form that is filled out for NCs (hadn't even heard of 8d and 5y!) and that's where I have the 'root cause analysis' section with a place for the steps to identify root cause and a place to record the actual cause. However, the staff 'skip' over how they got to the cause and just on the 'cause'. Ironically it was mentioned earlier that some people may sit around and shout out root causes.. I'm not sure ours is all that different, except we don't have the shouting.. we have one person thinking and then putting that down. There's room for improvement there to say the least.. (for me it's a start having them even record a nonconformance!).

I can see everyone's point of 'why wouldn't you record it?' which is very useful and I will try to relay that to the staff!

Thanks!
 

AMIT BALLAL

Trusted Information Resource
#15
Hi,
We record the steps followed for reaching to a final Root cause. It helps us to find the contributing causes & take actions on the same. As, 8D methodology also says that you should take actions on most contributing causes alongwith the Root cause.
And our lead auditor for TS was happy & pretty impressed to see what we did to reach to a root cause.

It would be useful to you too.

Regards,
Amit
 
Last edited:
I

iamtroll

#16
Bev has a good point, the information that you generate should be gathered when you are problem solving so that you can use it for training and also so that you don't forget anything. The other side to that is when you use a problem solving technique, 5Ys, 8D, brainstorming, etc. if you document what you do then you can see if you are using the tools correctly which give you an opportunity to refine you skills in problem solving. You should also consider that sometimes unfortunately you can come up with the wrong answer and if you have documented what you have done, you will hopefully not go down the wrong path again.
 
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